Bridging the Gap: Understanding Adulthood in Relationships

Bridging the Gap: Understanding Adulthood in Relationships

In the journey of life, few transitions are as mystifying and silently challenging as the leap from adolescence to adulthood, especially within the realm of relationships. As a marriage and family therapist, I've observed a curious phenomenon: society harbors a set of expectations for adults in relationships that, upon closer inspection, seem both unrealistic and unfairly imposed.

The Illusion of Adulthood

Firstly, let's tackle the elephant in the room: What does it mean to be an "adult" in a relationship? Society often paints a picture of adulthood that is tied to certain milestones—financial independence, marriage, parenthood—yet offers scant guidance on the emotional and relational competencies that truly define mature partnership. The result? A generation of adults navigating the complexities of love and commitment, armed with little more than ideals and expectations forged by external observers.

Learning on the Job

The reality is, most of us enter the world of adult relationships without a roadmap. Our education system prepares us for careers, but not for the intricacies of communication, empathy, and compromise that underpin a healthy relationship. We are left to learn from the examples set by our parents, the media, and our own trial and error—a process that is as fraught with challenges as it sounds.

A Shift in Empathy

Remarkably, our society extends a wealth of patience and guidance to the youth as they fumble through their formative years, learning the ropes of social interaction and self-awareness. Yet, this empathy wanes as the arbitrary threshold of adulthood is crossed. Suddenly, the 24-year-old who never mastered the art of emotional regulation or conflict resolution is met with criticism rather than support. This shift highlights a critical gap in our collective approach to personal development: the assumption that adulthood alone equips individuals with the skills necessary for mature relationships.

Embracing Continuous Growth

The truth is, maturity in relationships is not a milestone reached but a journey undertaken. It involves continuous learning, self-reflection, and the deliberate cultivation of skills such as empathy, communication, and conflict resolution. As individuals and as a society, we must recognize that the development of these skills is not guaranteed by the passage of time. Instead, it requires intentional effort and, often, external guidance.

Charting a New Course

So, where do we go from here? The path forward involves breaking down the stereotypes of adulthood and opening avenues for continuous personal growth. We can start by advocating for relationship education that extends beyond the school years, into adulthood. Workshops, therapy, reading materials, and support groups can all serve as resources for individuals seeking to enhance their relational skills.

Moreover, we must cultivate a culture of empathy and support that recognizes the ongoing nature of personal development. Just as we would not expect a teenager to navigate the complexities of adult life without guidance, we should not expect adults to master the nuances of relationships without a support system.

Conclusion

As we redefine what it means to be an adult in a relationship, we pave the way for healthier, more fulfilling partnerships. By acknowledging the gaps in our education and societal expectations, and by embracing the idea of lifelong learning, we can all move closer to the ideal of mature, supportive relationships that thrive on understanding and growth.

Embracing Wholeness: Understanding Resistance and Enhancing Intimacy in LDS Relationships

EMBRACING WHOLENESS: UNDERSTANDING RESISTANCE AND ENHANCING INTIMACY IN LDS RELATIONSHIPS

Introduction

Swiss psychiatrist Carl Gustav Jung, famed for his invaluable insights into the human psyche, opined, "What you resist not only persists, but will grow in size." For Latter-day Saints, incorporating this philosophy into our relationships opens the door to increased closeness and personal evolution. It's achieved by recognizing and merging the elements of our personalities that we may initially resist. Dive into Stanford's Encyclopedia of Philosophy for an exhaustive study of Jung's oeuvre. For further reading on Jung's work, you can check out Stanford's Encyclopedia of Philosophy.

The Role of Resistance in LDS Relationships

Resistance is a normal human response to change, discomfort, or perceived threats, often appearing as avoidance, denial, or procrastination. Jung's observation highlights that when we resist specific thoughts, feelings, or experiences, we unintentionally empower them, causing them to persist and possibly grow in magnitude.

Central to this idea is the concept of the "shadow," a term introduced by Jung to describe the repressed or disowned aspects of our psyche. The shadow represents parts of ourselves that we might view as negative, shameful, or unacceptable. By resisting or suppressing these aspects, we inadvertently give them more control over our lives and impact our LDS relationships. If you're interested in a comprehensive understanding of the "shadow" concept, you can refer to this Verywell Mind article.

The Gift of Resistance for Personal Growth in LDS Couples

Although it may seem counterintuitive, embracing and confronting our resistance can lead to personal growth and increased intimacy in our relationships. When we deny or suppress parts of ourselves, we hinder our potential and create internal conflict. The paradox is that by facing what we resist, we can move beyond it, fostering self-awareness, compassion, and a deeper understanding of our true selves. For guidance on strengthening relationships within the LDS context, please check this resource.

Welcoming the Shadow to Improve LDS Relationship Intimacy

Jung believed that by integrating the shadow, we could achieve psychological wholeness and a more balanced personality. This process involves acknowledging, understanding, and accepting the aspects of ourselves that we have been resisting. Here are some steps to welcome the shadow and nurture personal growth in LDS couples:

1. Self-awareness: Cultivate self-awareness to recognize and understand our resistance. Pay attention to recurring patterns, emotional triggers, and areas of discomfort in your life. These may point to unresolved issues or repressed aspects of your psyche that affect your LDS relationship.

2. Compassion: Approach your shadow with curiosity and compassion. Instead of judging or condemning these aspects of yourself, seek to understand the root causes and the role they play in your life and LDS relationship.

3. Expression: Discover healthy ways to express and explore your shadow. This could involve journaling, creating art, or participating in open and honest conversations with trusted friends or a therapist.

4. Integration: Endeavor to incorporate your shadow into your self-concept. Recognize that these aspects are a part of you and that they hold valuable insights and lessons for personal growth and LDS relationship enhancement.

For an interesting perspective on the resistance in the context of psychological growth, visit this Psychology Today article.

Conclusion

Jung's insight that "what you resist not only persists, but will grow in size" serves as a powerful reminder of the significance of facing our inner obstacles and embracing our authentic selves. By acknowledging and integrating the shadow, we can transform resistance into growth, ultimately leading to more balanced and fulfilling lives and LDS relationships. As Latter-day Saints, we understand the importance of continual progression, and embracing our resistance can be an invaluable catalyst for change and self-discovery in our journey to improve LDS relationship intimacy. For professional insights into how therapy can help with shadow work, refer to this GoodTherapy article.

Internet Filters, Apps and other Pornography Blockers

As a parent and practitioner, I’ve found one surety with internet pornography filters, they don’t work.

I’m not suggesting you don’t use internet filters or blockers, they can help be good to help prevent unwanted imagery and content. But internet filters and blockers as a means to control pornography usage, exposure, or relapse it’s essentially worthless and often expensive and ends up negatively affecting your devices. Furthermore, there is little to no evidence that filtering is effective at shielding young people from online sexual material.

… analyzing data collected a decade after these papers, provided strong evidence that caregivers' use of Internet filtering technologies did not reduce children's exposure to a range of aversive online experiences including, but not limited to, encountering sexual content that made them feel uncomfortable. Internet Filtering Technology and Aversive Online Experiences in Adolescents

The study looked at 9,352 male and 9,357 female subjects and found that almost 50 percent of the subjects had some sort of Internet filter at home. Regardless of the filters installed, subjects still saw approximately the same amount of porn.

“Many caregivers and policymakers consider Internet filters a useful technology for keeping young people safe online. Although this position might make intuitive sense, there is little empirical evidence that Internet filters provide an effective means to limit children’s and adolescents’ exposure to online sexual material. There are nontrivial economic, informational, and human rights costs associated with filtering that need to be balanced against any observed benefits,” wrote the researchers. “Given this, it is critical to know possible benefits can be balanced against their costs. Our studies were conducted to test this proposition, and our findings indicated that filtering does not play a practically significant protective role.” Researchers find that filters don’t prevent porn

Whenever a client says they’ve installed an internet filter I ask them if it works. In EVERY single case, the response is NO.

“I can hack it in less than a minute” - thirteen year old

“No, it’s very easy to get around the blocker” - forty-five-year-old husband

“I just use a different device” -thirty-two-year-old wife

“It’s just annoying, all I need to do is change how I search…” -twenty-year-old missionary

Then why do you have internet filters?

“Because my parents think they are punishing me” - thirteen year old

“If I don’t my wife will always think I’m betraying her…” - forty-five-year-old husband

“My Bishop told me I needed to.” -thirty-two-year-old wife

“these are church devices….” -twenty-year-old missionary

The limitation with internet filters:

In every situation there is one consistent, it gives the user and loved ones a sense of security and accountability, albeit a false sense of security.

The Guardian spoke to the failures of internet filtering by identifying twelve limitations;

1. It's impossible to filter just what you want to

There is a tradeoff between failing to block inappropriate content and erroneously blocking harmless material which is educational, medical, or artistic. A 2007 paper by the University of California, Berkeley, tested 15 combinations of internet content filters and filter settings. The most restrictive of those filters managed to block 91% of adult content – but it also mistakenly blocked 23% of "clean" webpages. The less restrictive filters had fewer errors but only managed to restrict access to 40% of material which was deemed inappropriate for children.

2. Filters can't cope with context and nuance

Filters that fail to distinguish between pornography and sites that provide advice on sexual health, sexuality and relationships could actually do more harm than good. ONS stats released on Thursday say 43% of people aged over 16 use the internet to seek health-related information – that figure has more than doubled since 2007 and will probably continue to rise.

3. You can't be clear about what you filter

It's virtually impossible to be transparent about internet filtering. There are 4.2m pornographic websites and 68m search engine requests to find those websites every day according to Internet Filter Review. Their statistics are likely to be guesstimates but they do show the sheer scale of a big chunk of our online world. Would the government publish a searchable database of every banned site? Would that list be updated regularly? With explanations about why each site was blocked? Probably not. That poses big problems for democratic principles such as oversight and accountability, especially when it's not clear why a site has been blocked. As the Internet Policy Review points out: "HTTP error codes are used by some filtering regimes. These are commonly either a 404 ('file not found') or 403 ('access denied') code." Those messages can mean very different things to an internet user.

4. It's not as simple as blocking a website

As well as performance issues, questions have been raised about the scope of internet filters. Some types of filters are unable to block material exchanged through peer-to-peer networks such as instant messaging, streaming video or file-sharing programs.

5. Many children are more tech-savvy than their parents

Children will simply change the settings. This is a criticism that Cameron may have pre-empted but did not necessarily address when he stated: "It should not be the case that technically literate children can just flick the filters off at the click of a mouse without anyone knowing … those filters can only be changed by the account holder, who has to be an adult." A US panel officially mandated by the Child Online Protection Act argued: "A child can simply guess the override security word/number set by a parent to switch a filter off for adult use (how many parents set their password to their birth date or license plate number)." Crudely put, a filter has to be simple enough for technologically feeble adults but difficult enough to stop a tech-savvy 17-year-old working out how to bypass it. Arguably, no such filter exists.

6. There will always be ways round

Proxy servers can be used to bypass the filters. And there are countless tutorials online about how to use these servers. Attempts to block search results for "how do I bypass the filter?" would also need to block search results for "how can I see search results for the question how do I bypass the filter?".

7. For parents it may provide a dangerous illusion of safety

Filters could send the wrong message to parents that their children are unable to access inappropriate content online. Adults would have a false impression of security and fail to take steps to inform their children about online risks.

8. Filtering at the router level is inflexible

The proposals are unworkable because they are not device-specific. A household may want one level of internet filtering for its shared computer, and another entirely for its mobile phones.

9. It sets a precedent for restricting legal content

Some of the content which Cameron proposes to filter is legal. Campaigners such as the Open Rights Group believe that excluding legal material online amounts to censorship and that it sets a dangerous precedent for other groups in the UK (and other governments abroad) who have an interest in suppressing information. Some specific cases illustrate the point well. The Clinton administration might have appreciated mandatory pornography filters at the time of the Monica Lewinsky scandal, for example.

10. It's not cost-effective

High-profile technology advisers such as the Wikipedia co-founder Jimmy Wales have claimed that the plans are a "ridiculous idea" because they waste money that would be better spent on bolstering police resources to deal with online crime. Even the 2008 report by the Australian Communications and Media Authority admitted in its conclusion that it had not been able to "consider the balance of costs and benefits" associated with implementing filters.

11. It hasn't happened yet

We've been here before. Cameron "unveiled" almost identical plans in October 2011. That would suggest at best that these plans are difficult to implement and at worst that they are distraction policies, designed to deflect attention from more detrimental news items. Cynics will be quick to point out that the plans were unveiled the same day that a group of MPs released a report saying that official migration statistics were dangerously inaccurate and "could be out by tens of thousands". It was also the day that the "go home" poster campaign designed to target illegal immigrants attracted criticism.

12. And finally it's a gimmick rather than a solution

Internet filters obscure the real debate about the psychological, social, and physical effects of online porn.

Furthermore, I’ll add that internet filters add to the unhealthy behavior by artificially creating a sense of security in the home. In a lot of cases, the spouse becomes a reviewer and manager of the other’s behavior. As opposed to the individual taking ownership and developing impulse control. For parents, internet filters also provide a false sense of security and place too much trust in the technology instead of learning how to positively interact with their children and help them to navigate exposure to pornography.

In summary, internet filters can be useful to help mitigate unwanted imagery and content in the home. But is often an expensive ‘virus’ that negatively affects your devices and has little to no effect in preventing compulsive porn use and can add to unhealthy dynamics in relationships. As one of the “Improving Intimacy” Admins put its;

My recommendation: don’t. No filtering software or device is perfect and sometimes it can become a game to figure out how to “beat” it. That makes it more enticing and rewarding. If he wants to look at porn, he’s going to.

Also, I’d suggest you take yourself out of the equation. It’s not your job as his wife to monitor or manage his devices. Doing so just creates an unequal power dynamic and will erode trust and intimacy. It puts you in a parenting role, instead of an equal spouse role. It’s his struggle to deal with. The motivation to overcome the habit has to come from inside him or nothing will work. Bradley Kent Cammack - Improving Intimacy

Alternatives to pornography internet filters:

The most effective approach to compulsive use of porn is engaging in loving and healthy conversations about pornography. Some of the best resources and alternatives to filters;

1. Pornography Filters: Part of The Solution? Or Part Of The Problem?

2. Changing the narrative around the addiction story | Cameron Staley | TEDxIdahoStateUniversity

3. Life After Porn

4. https://www.danielaburgess.com/pornography

5. Science Stopped Believing in Porn Addiction

6. The Naked People In Your iPod

7. What We (Don't) Talk About When We Talk About Porn

8. Rethinking Porn Addiction

Its Not Your Fault: When Couples Counseling and Coaching Doesn't Work

Improving Intimacy Relationships, Sustainably, Long Lasting Friendship

You’re not a failure, and it’s not your fault. Even if you and your partner have consulted the best relationship coaches and marriage therapists, it’s not your fault that intimacy didn’t improve or faded over time. It’s tempting to point fingers or take the blame, but the reality is that more often than not, couples “give up” or fail to see sustainable improvement for a few reasons:

1. Focusing too much on mechanics, such as tools, skills, and techniques

2. No or a lack of role models

3. A focus on measuring failures rather than successes

In my Improving Intimacy online course, we delve deep into these patterns to help couples understand and overcome these obstacles.

Early in my work with couples, I noticed a pattern in marital issues that completely changed the way I approached couples' work, resulting in quicker changes and long-term sustainability. As I first addressed in my article, “Marital Myth of Communication: It’s never about communication.”, couples weren’t failing because they lacked marital communication skills. Instead, too much focus on the mechanics of communication, skill, and techniques could easily slide into weaponized forms of communication I call "Book Speak" in my course. This phenomenon occurs when individuals or couples embrace a new book, expert, or modality and essentially replace their current language with new vocabulary or phrases.

"Daniel, we have spent thousands on individual and couples counseling and nearly a decade fighting to save our marriage. We learned every marriage skill and communication tool out there, it would seem to work for a while but eventually the effectiveness of those tools would wear off. It was a vicious cycle of highs and lows. The tools never seemed to created lasting, sustainable improvement. But in just a few weeks you have changed that cycle in our marriage. For the first time in our marriage we feel safe, we feel loved and we have moved from managing our relationship to connecting and healing." C.M. & M.M.

Many of the couples I’ve worked with had already consulted multiple relationship experts, therapists, and coaches. They spent thousands of dollars and claimed it was life-changing, but they still found themselves facing the same issues. In a study published in January 2020, researchers found that negative communication between spouses can be difficult to change, and changing it does not necessarily lead to more satisfying relationships. Furthermore, it doesn't always predict distress in the first place.

…contrary to predictions of behavioral models of marriage, negative communication between spouses can be difficult to change, does not necessarily lead to more satisfying relationships when it is changed, and does not always predict distress in the first place.

In my experience and according to current research, the greatest predictor of divorce or marital success is correlated to the couple’s established friendship prior to marriage. Marriage is a complex and challenging relationship. We enter into serious, lifelong commitments with little to no training, often in our most immature adult years, and expect a level of success that few, even relationship experts, experience.

You did not fail, you did not give up; you were never taught. While mechanics in marital communication can help, what creates long-lasting sustainability is relationship awareness, fostering adoration, and embracing the best. As pointed out in the same study, relationships can improve without overt improvements in communication.

Perhaps the most basic assumption underlying research on marital interaction is that specific behaviors, and specific patterns of interaction, reliably predict relationship distress and dissolution for most couples (e.g., Jacobson & Margolin, 1979). Early success at differentiating satisfied from distressed couples cross-sectionally held out promise that a distinct behavioral profile might characterize at-risk couples, as evidenced by distressed couples’ higher rates of negative behaviors, heightened reactivity to and reciprocation of negative behaviors, and sustained cycles of negativity (e.g., Margolin & Wampold, 1981; see Woodin, 2011 for a review), particularly during problem-solving conversations. In longitudinal studies, however, these same behavioral patterns have not emerged consistently as predictors of declines in relationship satisfaction (for a review, see Bradbury & Lavner, 2012). One possible explanation for the inconsistent findings is that the behavioral differences identified in cross-sectional studies may be a consequence rather than a cause of relationship distress. Another possibility is that the behaviors displayed by clinically distressed couples provide a misleading starting point for understanding how well-functioning relationships are maintained and how they change.

Furthermore, this study casts light onto a phenomenon I also discovered when focusing on mechanics within couples’ work, an emotional double bind where you see both successes and decrease satisfaction;

When distressed couples participate in empirically-supported forms of therapy, and thus are presumably motivated to grapple with and repair interpersonal deficits, a different understanding of couple communication emerges: from pre-treatment to two years following completion of treatment, observed rates of negativity and withdrawal decline by nearly half, but rates of unilateral positivity decline as well, to levels below those observed prior to the start of treatment (Baucom, Sevier, Eldridge, Doss, & Christensen, 2011).

It’s not your fault, but you can change the pattern now and set an example for future generations. My wife and I have learned these lessons and have modeled them for our children, who are now married. We created the Improving Intimacy online course to provide an in-depth look into how we did it and what really creates long-term sustainability in thriving relationships.

Improving Intimacy

Improving Intimacy online Course

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Couple Highlight: Jordan and Bronwen

This post is part of the series, “Couple Highlights.” Each Couple Highlight was originally shared in the Improving Intimacy in Latter-Day Saint Relationships Facebook Group, which is a private group. In order to share these posts publicly on danielaburgess.com, explicit written consent was granted by each couple.

Couple Highlights began on the Facebook Group as a way to hear about the growth happening for couples in the group, and to give them an opportunity to share their story--their marriage journey, where they are at, and the challenges they’ve overcome.

Hi everyone! We are Jordan and Bronwen Merrill. We met in November 2015 when Bronwen’s best friend, Lexi, introduced Bronwen to her current boyfriend: Jordan. They got along well and Bronwen remembers thinking that Jordan was quite the catch. But, Bronwen was dating someone else at the time and was living in Florida for an internship in Walt Disney World. By the following January, Bronwen had returned to BYU for Winter Semester and was “on a break” with the previously mentioned boyfriend. By chance, on the very first day of the semester, she crossed paths with Jordan. She remembered exactly who he was (“her best friend’s boyfriend”), but Jordan didn’t realize the connection, thinking Bronwen was a beautiful girl he’d met but couldn’t remember where. Bronwen re-established how they knew each other, and Jordan, slightly embarrassed, told Bronwen that since Lexi was entering the MTC in February that they were no longer dating.

Bronwen knew that she couldn’t possibly date her best friend’s ex-boyfriend. But, she was just returning to Utah after 8 months of living away, and could definitely use a friend. They exchanged numbers and got to talking. Very quickly, Bronwen realized that she liked Jordan...a lot. Jordan offered to drive Bronwen to the grocery store. They studied together in the library. They decided to hang-out (NOT a date!) and make waffles together before watching a movie with Bronwen’s roommates. Bronwen told her roommates that they could NOT abandon her that evening, because she really liked Jordan but couldn’t do anything about it! She needed group protection so that nothing would happen.

Well, that non-date ended up being pretty good. Jordan and Bronwen were getting along great, and after the movie, ALL of Bronwen’s roommates did the very thing she told them not to do--they abandoned her and left her with a cute boy! That not-a-date ended up being the night of their first kiss. After Jordan had left, Bronwen called her mom and told her that 1) she was going to officially break-up with the guy she was “on a break” with (mom was pleased, she’d never liked him anyway), and 2) she was pretty sure she wanted to marry Jordan. (Jordan didn’t feel *quite* that strongly about the relationship at the start, but it didn’t take him long to get on the same page.)

Jordan proposed in July and they got married in December 2016.

Since then, Bronwen and Jordan have moved homes TEN times. They’ve lived in 8 different cities, 2 different states, and 3 different countries. They currently live in France, where Bronwen is a Parade Performer in Disneyland Paris and Jordan is a Live Streamer for Twitch.tv.

I’m going to break from speaking in the third person now, since talking about our intimate life together from an outside perspective seems a little odd to me. Haha!

Over the last 4 years, we have learned a lot about ourselves, each other, and our relationship. Just last week, we made some major break-throughs regarding the communication styles we prefer! We feel we are constantly learning, growing, and adapting our relationship so that we can both experience great happiness.

In the beginning of our marriage, I (Bronwen) had a hard time adjusting to being on birth-control (I was taking the pill at the time) and my sex drive was really low. This was frustrating for both of us, and I felt a huge sense of guilt for not wanting to be intimate. Those early conversations were difficult as I tried to express that my lack of libido had nothing to do with my feelings for Jordan. It took somewhere between 6 months to a year for me to feel a little more “normal” on the pill. During this time we still had sex, and those times were great, but we weren’t having sex as often as we thought we would be.

It wasn’t until early 2019 that I switched to Nexplanon (arm implant) for birth control, and it made a world of difference for me. Jordan noticed it, too. I know that any form of hormonal birth control “messes with” my hormones, but Nexplanon has been really great for me. We aren’t in a place where we are “ready” (not a great word choice, it’s obviously more nuanced than that, but roll with me here) to have children right now, and being a Parade Performer at Disney while pregnant...it’s just not a great mix.

We are so happy to be our little family of two. We’ve loved being able to travel, follow our dreams and support each other in those dreams. We’re not entirely sure where life will take us next, but we know one thing: we’re happy to be going there together.

How Can I Resist Pornography?

How Can I Resist Pornography?

The following is a resource for June 13, 2021, Young Men and Young Women lesson discussing pornography as part of the Come Follow Me curriculum. Here's the lesson: How Can I Resist Pornography?

Our natural affections are planted in us by the Spirit of God, for a wise purpose; and they are the very main-springs of life and happiness—they are the cement of all virtuous and heavenly society—they are the essence of charity, or love; and therefore never fail, but endure forever. – Essential Parley P. Pratt, Chapter 10 “Intelligence and Affection”

… it is important not to label even intensive or habitual use of pornography as an addiction because that does not accurately describe the circumstances or the full nature of the required repentance and recovery. Having a better understanding of where a person is in the process will also allow a better understanding of what action is necessary to recover. Elder Oaks What do I need to understand about the scope of pornography use?

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***Authors Note: This lesson is designed to meet the needs of a diverse audience and forums; adults, children, leadership, Sunday School, Elder Quorum, Relief Society, Firesides, etc. Please prayerfully select the sections and content/sections you believe are MOST applicable to the audience and purpose of your lesson. Due to the complexity and frequent misconceptions around this topic, I’ve intentionally included a comprehensive resource. There is NO expectation for ALL the material listed below to be covered in a brief 15-30 min lesson, please plan accordingly.***

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This resource is divided into the following sections:

1. Background - 'The Why'

2. How Can I Resist Pornography? - Outline

3. Love Versus Fear

4. Counsel Together

5. Lesson Activity and Discussion

6. Lesson Resources

7. Quotes About Marital Intimacy

8. Addressing Concerns

Due to the nature of this particular lesson on pornography and chastity, I offer a background of my ‘why’ for providing this resource. This Background section is NOT needed for the lesson but many might find it helpful and relatable. If you want to skip to the actual lesson prep section, scroll down to “How Can I Resist Pornography?” or click the link in the menu.

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Background - 'The Why'

No greater responsibility can rest upon any man (or woman) than to be a teacher of God’s children. — Elder David O. McKay, Conference Report, Oct. 1916, 57.

Without a doubt, I’ve experienced the greatest insights, edification, and lifting up of souls when I approach teaching with this sense of great responsibility. There is a beauty that results when one pours their heart, mind, and soul into studying the teachings of Christ. In spite of mortal limitations and weaknesses, thoughts are guided by the spirit in a way that edifies and draws the teacher and student closer to God. Anyone who has taught the gospel of Christ has most likely had this experience. It changes your life in some way each time it happens. This edification comes from one’s prayerful guidance and spiritual influence. At times the spirit takes you beyond the provided lesson material or guides you in a direction that builds on the basic concepts presented. I testify that there is no greater calling than to be a teacher. There is no more universal way to emulate Christ than to honor the sacred opportunities to teach.

In the following, I’m going to provide real examples (names changed) of how teaching from a place of hope, clarity, and love has a more positive and lasting effect on souls than teaching with fear.

Rachel (F54): "Since joining ARP five years ago, my issues with porn have increased. I’m so confused. I don’t want this filth in my life, but I can’t seem to go more than a few weeks at a time without slipping. If my faith and ARP can’t help me, is it too late for me?"

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Caleb (M16): Came in feeling absolutely hopeless. “I have been doing everything the bishop said I should, and it makes no difference," he said. He recounted hearing the same counsel from his bishop and parents over and over: read your scriptures, memorize hymns, pray, try harder, think of something different, etc. Through sobs, he talked about praying that these feelings and desires would just go away so he wouldn’t look at porn anymore. What started as 5 to 10 minute prayers had become one to two hour-long desperate pleadings that his “temptations and desires” would just go away. When prayer didn’t work to eliminate these feelings, his faith began to wane. He truly struggled as he first began to doubt himself and then God. He was at the end of his rope.

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David (M48): "Help me please, I don’t know what to do, I’m scared. We have spent almost all our retirement ($50,000+) on one of the best porn addiction treatment programs available. But at best, I still struggle with porn use as I did prior to treatment, but if I’m honest with myself it’s probably worse now. But no one knows. I’m afraid to tell my wife. Because if the best treatment can’t help me, what does that mean about me?"

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Jordan (M15): "I’ve destroyed my chances of marrying my future wife and I have disappointed my children. What’s the point of even going on living anymore? I can’t stop looking at porn and I don’t want to become a sexual predator."

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Allison (F34): Feeling the years of struggle weighing on her and wondering if her faith was ever real, she had followed every piece of counsel and still felt that hope was wearing thin. Before giving up, she wanted to try one last time to get professional help, as a final reassurance to herself that she had done everything she could before calling it quits. She recognized that doing more of the same wasn’t working, and decided to include a therapist in her recovery process. She found me in a listing of Latter-day Saint counselors and reached out. Allison bravely explained her situation in raw honesty. She was out of options. Her leaders didn’t know what else to offer her other than the counsel to pray, study, and have “more faith.” But she was already doing all of those things without success. She simply didn’t know what else she could possibly do.

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Scott Cannon (M30s): Stood in front of his congregation and spoke openly about his lifelong struggle with pornography: a struggle that he saw as an addiction and, because he believed what he was told at church, a struggle that would likely ruin his life.

“By age 16 when I looked at myself in the mirror I saw someone no good Mormon girl would ever marry," Cannon said over the pulpit. "I saw someone who was losing the battle with Satan. I hated myself. I hated what I had become. I regretted that I had ever been born.”

Cannon says it was a kind of on-again/off-again relationship with pornography. There were periods of months and years where he successfully avoided it. He began hoping that when it came his time to die and meet God, it would happen during one of those clean streaks. That thinking led him to a very dangerous conclusion.

“I realized that my best and perhaps only option would be to choose for myself when I would go to meet God," said Cannon.

He was suicidal. And then he kind of snapped out of it. He started doing research of his own and discovered that from a clinical perspective, pornography was not nearly as destructive as he had thought. Stigma Of Pornography Brings Consequences Of Its Own

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Meredith (F43): Found out her husband was viewing pornography. She had sounded frantic on the phone, so I made room for her in my schedule that same night.

“My entire marriage feels like a lie,” Meredith tearfully shared. The evening before, she had picked up his phone to look something up online since she had left her phone upstairs. As she typed her search into the address bar, the browser started suggesting pornographic sites. She checked the browser history and found various websites that he had been visiting repeatedly.

She continued, her words full of confusion and anger, “I prayed all day about how to approach him about it. I tried to talk with him when he got home about what I had found last night. He got so upset and just kept denying it over and over. I finally grabbed his phone from him and showed him the browser history. He got quiet and said that he has been looking at porn all through our marriage and was masturbating to it too. We’ve been married for nine years! This has been going on for nine years!”

She thought she had a strong, solid marriage and an absolute best friend. He was always a doting husband, and she never felt like anything was amiss. He was a fantastic father who set a good example for the kids and was always there for them. She seemed unable to make sense of the discrepancy between the way she had always regarded him and what she was now learning about him.

“How could this happen?” Meredith demanded. “How can he just throw away our temple marriage like this?” She suddenly felt trapped in a marriage with someone she couldn’t trust and feared how this would affect her and their kids’ future. She wondered if it was best for her and the kids to leave the “dangerous” influences of her husband's behavior. She desperately wanted to feel hopeful but couldn’t see how to, based on the damage she believed pornography caused to a person.

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What do these real-life examples have in common? They were all taught the ‘harms’ of pornography in their lessons on chastity in church. But never HOW to have thriving, loving relationships that had the skills to navigate difficult topics like pornography use.

They are not exceptions, they are not alone. As a mental health therapist specializing in the treatment of porn/sex issues, I can tell you that no one is immune to these unfortunate and false views. Bishops, Relief Society Presidents, youth, parents, these unchristlike perspectives deny the atonement and harm individuals and families more than viewing porn harms the individual and family. Having worked with leaders throughout the world, helping them to address the problem of pornography in their Wards and Branches, I can tell you firsthand how destructive these views are.

Now compare the experiences of those above with these real-life examples.

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Leanne is a wife of 31 years: When my husband and I started the journey of turning towards each other in all of the aspects of our lives and began to create a truly intimate marriage, the “need” for my husband to turn to porn left him. And my “need” to constantly check up on him left me. And I was healed from being stuck in betrayal trauma. The connection that we made in turning towards one another to proactively create what we really wanted for our marriage was the answer to porn not being an issue for either of us from that point forward. Turning towards each other healed both of us. Read and listen to her full experience here: How Desiring to Understand My Husband’s Struggle Led to Healthy Dialogue and Healing and Discovering My Own Sexuality

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Allison (F34): "The moment I changed my prayers from 'help me to stop viewing porn' to 'help me understand my sexual desires,' there was an immediate change that came over me. It felt freeing and I felt God’s love pour over me in a way I haven’t felt before. The desire to view porn melted away, some temptation but nothing like before, it was easily manageable. I’m no longer scared of porn."

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David (M48): "It seems so obvious now. I was giving porn way too much power by always framing my strategy around avoiding temptation and the consequences of porn. However, when I turned to the Lord and talked with him about my sexual desires, it felt very weird at first, and like something was trying to keep me from doing it. Maybe the adversary, maybe the years of addiction treatment, I’m not sure. But once I pushed through the awkward, it was like a sense of clarity and hope I’d been longing for all this time. The temptation hasn’t left completely, but the more I learn about my body and my desires the easier it gets."

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Again, these are just a few examples of how teaching correct principles in a christ-like way empowers people to their full potential. Unfortunately, in the hopes to ‘warn’ of potential dangers, many end up only teaching, embellishing, or pulling from the worst examples. Instead of focusing on how to learn of our desires and including God in that process, the teaching focus is overcome by fear and an “avoid at all cost” mentality. As Carl Jung put it, “what you resist not only persists, but will grow in size”!

Unfortunately, I believe this particular lesson; “How Can I Resist Pornography?” is similar to the chewed-up bubble gum, fence with a nail, or the old wedding dress lessons many of us adults experienced growing up. Let us learn from the past and refocus on the central message of Jesus Christ.

The hope with this particular lesson resource is that it will help each of you with that sacred process of preparing to teach and delivering this message in a way that is in harmony with the doctrine of Christ -- one that fosters hope in the recipient, and prepares them to address the challenge of pornography in their life.

It’s impossible to provide all the right answers and information in a lesson written for a general worldwide audience and in a comparatively very short time frame. Most will only have 15-25 mins to deliver a core message -- and for a topic as big as pornography and chastity, it’s critical that core truths and a message of love is shared clearly in that invaluable amount of time. I assure you, just like you remember the scary, fear-based chastity lessons of your youth, these children will remember these 15-25 minute chastity or porn lessons for the rest of their lives. Therefore, this is the opportunity for you to make a Christlike impression that will fortify these youth (and yourself) for the rest of their lives.

Unfortunately, the resources the Church offers are not always ideal, and we shouldn’t expect the Church to provide for ALL our lesson preparation. Elder Ballard has expressed his concern that we as Latter-day Saints "expect too much from Church leaders" and has strongly encouraged us TO SEEK out experts, even outside the church. He said;

…it is important to remember that I am a General Authority, but that does not make me an authority in general!

My calling and life experiences allow me to respond to certain types of questions. There are other types of questions that require an expert in a specific subject matter. This is exactly what I do when I need an answer to such questions: I seek help from others, including those with degrees and expertise in such fields.

I worry sometimes that members expect too much from Church leaders and teachers—­expecting them to be experts in subjects well beyond their duties and responsibilities. The Lord called the apostles and prophets to invite ­others to come unto Christ—not to obtain advanced degrees in ancient history, biblical studies, and other fields that may be useful in answering all the questions we may have about scriptures, history, and the Church. Our primary duty is to build up the Church, teach the doctrine of Christ, and help those in need of help...

If you have a question that requires an expert, please take the time to find a thoughtful and qualified expert to help you. There are many on this campus and elsewhere who have the degrees and expertise to respond and give some insight to most of these types of questions.

Fortunately, the Lord provided this counsel for those asking questions:

Seek ye diligently and teach one another words of ­wisdom; yea, seek ye out of the best books words of wisdom; seek learning, even by study and also by faith.

If you have a question that requires an expert, please take the time to find a thoughtful and qualified expert to help you. There are many on this campus and elsewhere who have the degrees and expertise to respond and give some insight to most of these types of questions.

Now let’s turn our attention to a few of the questions you have submitted to me. I reviewed them to cover as broadly as possible the same topics mentioned many different times. Questions and Answers Elder Ballard of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles November 14, 2017

How Can I Resist Pornography? - Outline

Due to the complexity, misinformation, and sensitivity of this topic please consider approaching this lesson in the following ways;

1. Spirit of prayer and fasting;

As you seek the guidance and wisdom of the spirit, your mind and heart will be able to decipher truth from error and teach this topic. You will also know how to present this lesson in a tone of love that will be the most effective in helping the recipient follow the covenant path.

2. Start class with YM/YW Theme and Counsel Together
3. Review the section on Love Versus Fear
4. Prayerfully select which resources to prepare with and discuss with class;

The resources provided in this lesson are intended only as preparation material. It’s impossible to cover all the resources and topics, in the time allotted. Therefore, prayerfully select the concepts you believe are best for your participants. Also, if you haven’t already read through the Background - 'The Why', doing so might help you prepare for this lesson.

5. Optional: Section Quotes About Marital Intimacy and Addressing Concerns is an additional resource to help navigate potential concerns.

LOVE VERSUS FEAR

A better way to teach is with love. Undoubtedly, each of your YM or YW will be uncomfortable talking about chastity and pornography. You might even be uncomfortable teaching this lesson. Embrace the awkward with love. Unfortunately, this awkwardness is a result of teaching this topic out of fear, not love.

President Dieter F. Uchtdorf made this profound observation when he stated in General Conference;

People who are fearful may say and do the right things, but they do not feel the right things. They often feel helpless and resentful, even angry. Over time these feelings lead to mistrust, defiance, even rebellion. Perfect Love Casteth Out Fear

Frequently, Latter-day Saints attend therapy to address their pornography use after years of working with their Bishop, Stake President, or attending ARP or another 12-step program. In nearly 100% of these cases, their struggle to succeed is a result of fear-based sexual health, chastity lessons, or the recovery program they are using. Elder Uchtdorf further cautions the use of fear, even if it seems ‘effective’;

It is true that fear can have a powerful influence over our actions and behavior. But that influence tends to be temporary and shallow. Fear rarely has the power to change our hearts, and it will never transform us into people who love what is right and who want to obey Heavenly Father. Perfect Love Casteth Out Fear

Therefore, please prayerfully consider how fear is influencing your understanding of pornography and how you can follow the counsel of President Uchtdorf by teaching “a better way” with love.

My message has two purposes today: The first is to urge us to contemplate and consider the extent to which we use fear to motivate others—including ourselves. The second is to suggest a better way. Perfect Love Casteth Out Fear

Counsel Together

Led by a member of the quorum or class presidency; approximately 10–20 minutes

At the beginning of the meeting, repeat together the Young Women Theme or the Aaronic Priesthood Quorum Theme. Then lead a discussion about the work of salvation and exaltation using one or more of the questions below or questions of your own. (see General handbook, (10.2), (11.2),ChurchofJesusChrist.org). Plan ways to act on what you discuss.

Live the gospel. What recent experiences have strengthened our testimonies?

Care for those in need. Who needs our help and prayers? What do we feel impressed to do to help them?

Invite all to receive the gospel. How can we be a light to family members or friends who don’t share our beliefs?

Unite families for eternity. How can we show more love and support for our families and make a positive difference in our homes?

At the end of the lesson, as appropriate, do the following:

Testify of the principles taught.

Remind quorum or class members about the plans and invitations made during the meeting.

Aaronic Priesthood Quorum Theme

I am a beloved son of God, and He has a work for me to do.

With all my heart, might, mind, and strength, I will love God, keep my covenants, and use His priesthood to serve others, beginning in my own home.

As I strive to serve, exercise faith, repent, and improve each day, I will qualify to receive temple blessings and the enduring joy of the gospel.

I will prepare to become a diligent missionary, loyal husband, and loving father by being a true disciple of Jesus Christ.

I will help prepare the world for the Savior’s return by inviting all to come unto Christ and receive the blessings of His Atonement.

Young Women Theme

I am a beloved daughter of heavenly parents, with a divine nature and eternal destiny.

As a disciple of Jesus Christ, I strive to become like Him. I seek and act upon personal revelation and minister to others in His holy name.

I will stand as a witness of God at all times and in all things and in all places.

As I strive to qualify for exaltation, I cherish the gift of repentance and seek to improve each day. With faith, I will strengthen my home and family, make and keep sacred covenants, and receive the ordinances and blessings of the holy temple.

Lesson Activity and Discussion

A variety of discussion topics are provided below, prayerfully select the discussion topics you believe will best meet the needs of your class.

1. Assign your YM/YW to watch Changing the narrative around the addiction story, LDS Neuroscientist Cameron Staley Ph.D. in preparation to discuss how we can have a more loving and Christ-like approach to pornography.

• How does Cameron Staley Ph.D. suggest we change the narrative around pornography use?

• Does this feel like a more loving, inviting, and encouraging approach? What about it feels more loving?

• How do you feel this approach will improve your relationship with yourself, your Heavenly Parents, your future spouse, and your future children?

2. Have class review and discuss Why Was Corianton’s Sin So Serious?

• How can understanding the doctrine in the Book of Mormon correctly help us to follow the covenant path and avoid fear and sexual shame?

Sexual sin was NOT equivalent to “shedding innocent blood and denying the Holy Ghost.” Rather, it was the act of leading others into apostasy through sinful behavior that was, in Alma’s view, next to shedding innocent blood and denying the Holy Ghost in seriousness. Given that he himself was once guilty of that particular crime (Mosiah 27; Alma 36), Alma’s pleading with Corianton to repent is all the more powerful (Alma 39:9–13).

see also related articles;

• Scriptural Chastity Lessons: Joseph and Potiphar's Wife; Corianton and the Harlot Isabel

• The Sin “Next to Murder”: An Alternative Interpretation

3. In his article Recovering from the Trap of Pornography, by Elder Dallin H. Oaks Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, Elder Oaks warns against calling pornography viewing an ‘addiction’.

Also see the Churches offical page on NOT calling pornography use as an addiction: What do I need to understand about the scope of pornography use?

• What does Elder Oaks say is the risk of labeling someone as a porn addict?

Answer could include:

“… it is important not to label even intensive or habitual use of pornography as an addiction because that does not accurately describe the circumstances or the full nature of the required repentance and recovery. Having a better understanding of where a person is in the process will also allow a better understanding of what action is necessary to recover.”

• How might calling something an addiction prevent someone from repenting and having hope in the atonement?

• In the official Church resource "What do I need to understand about the scope of pornography use?" Instructs us to NOT call pornography use an "Addiction". What reasons does it give for this requests? What does this resource say should be considered in assessing the serioiusness of the pornography use? Why is considering these points of assessment critical in supporting the individual?

Answer could include:

"As you encourage individuals to understand their use of pornography as something more than just a sign of moral weakness, they can determine what, if any, additional resources they need. For example, pornography use usually has several contributing factors (such as biological, psychological, social, and spiritual). Resources needed will depend upon the severity of individual’s behavior and how he or she is dealing with the issue."

Frequency

Frequency refers to how often an individual engages in the behavior. Sporadic viewing of pornography indicates a milder problem, although this conduct is still clearly inappropriate. The more frequently an individual views pornography, the more serious the problem.

Duration

Duration refers to how long an individual has been engaged in the behavior. If an individual has been unable to stop viewing pornography for a period of years, it will most likely be more difficult for him or her to overcome the behavior than if he or she has only been using pornography for a short period of time.

Intensity

Intensity refers to the nature of the material viewed. While all pornographic images and content are inappropriate, some types of material are significantly more degrading. As you learn about a member’s issue, it is important to note the type of pornography he or she has been viewing.

For example, media that depict sexual acts are more intense and graphic than photographs of individuals wearing little or no clothing. Some pornographic material is violent or involves children. If you become aware of any viewing, purchasing, or distributing of child pornography, contact civil authorities. A help line is also available for the bishop in dealing with this issue.

Risk-Taking

Risk-taking tendencies or behaviors related to pornography use are another indicator of how severe the challenge may be. The more an individual is willing to risk to view pornography, the more difficult it generally is for him or her to discontinue its use. Risk-taking activities may include missing school, work, or other commitments; engaging in unlawful, covert, or dishonest behavior; or similar actions. Risk-taking behavior in adults may lead to loss of employment, divorce, family disruption, or criminal activity.

4. In Daniel A. Burgess LMFT interview, Is Pornography Always an ADDICTION??, he suggests a few ways leadership can support its members struggling with pornography with a more loving and Christ-like approach.

• For the best protection against pornography, what does Daniel suggest Bishops should do with members confessing pornography use?

Answer could include:

• Encourage partaking of the sacrament and attending the temple.

• Changing prayer language from “how to stop pornography” to seeking greater love and understanding of their sexual development and desires.

• How can partaking of the sacrament and attending the temple bring us closer to God when struggling with pornography?

• How does changing our language in prayer foster love over fear?

5. Study “Whoever Looks at a Woman With Lust”: Misinterpreted Bible Passages #1.

• In what ways does Jason A. Staples Ph.D. say we incorrectly use and understand “lust” according to Matthew 5:27–28?

• What are the four reasons Jason A. Staples Ph.D. gives for why misunderstanding Matthew 5:27–28 is dangerous?

6. Request participants, to either watch “Why Is Porn A Problem?” or show sections in class.

• Explore with the class what the experts say is the reason why some can't stop looking at pornography?

• What are their responses to the questions or thoughts on, are we evil for viewing porn?

• How do they suggest moving forward and recovering?

• What do the experts say for the reason porn viewing can hurt oneself and their spouse?

• Open discussion; Have the class share what they found most insightful, or helpful in the “Why Is Porn A Problem?” video. How do their new insights bring us closer to our Heavenly Parents and increase our hope?

Depending on the maturity and readiness of the class you might also consider reviewing the relationship aspects discussed in “Why Is Porn A Problem?”

• How can we prepare now for a future spouse who might view pornography?

• In what ways can we support our spouse or future spouse?

Lesson Resources

Prior to teaching this lesson have your class read, watch, listen, in part or full the following resources:

1. Perfect Love Casteth Out Fear By President Dieter F. Uchtdorf Second Counselor in the First Presidency

2. Why Was Corianton’s Sin So Serious?

see also related articles;

• Scriptural Chastity Lessons: Joseph and Potiphar's Wife; Corianton and the Harlot Isabel

• The Sin “Next to Murder”: An Alternative Interpretation

3. Recovering from the Trap of Pornography By Elder Dallin H. Oaks Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles

4. Changing the narrative around the addiction story, LDS Neuroscientist Cameron Staley Ph.D.

5. Is Pornography Always an ADDICTION??

6. Rethinking Porn Addiction

7. “Whoever Looks at a Woman With Lust”: Misinterpreted Bible Passages #1

8. The Naked People In Your iPod

Paul Malan · The Naked People In Your iPod

9. Is Masturbation a Sin?

10. Official LDS resource: What do I need to understand about the scope of pornography use?

    “… it is important not to label even intensive or habitual use of pornography as an addiction because that does not accurately describe the circumstances or the full nature of the required repentance and recovery. Having a better understanding of where a person is in the process will also allow a better understanding of what action is necessary to recover.”

"As you encourage individuals to understand their use of pornography as something more than just a sign of moral weakness, they can determine what, if any, additional resources they need. For example, pornography use usually has several contributing factors (such as biological, psychological, social, and spiritual). Resources needed will depend upon the severity of individual’s behavior and how he or she is dealing with the issue."

Frequency

Frequency refers to how often an individual engages in the behavior. Sporadic viewing of pornography indicates a milder problem, although this conduct is still clearly inappropriate. The more frequently an individual views pornography, the more serious the problem.

Duration

Duration refers to how long an individual has been engaged in the behavior. If an individual has been unable to stop viewing pornography for a period of years, it will most likely be more difficult for him or her to overcome the behavior than if he or she has only been using pornography for a short period of time.

Intensity

Intensity refers to the nature of the material viewed. While all pornographic images and content are inappropriate, some types of material are significantly more degrading. As you learn about a member’s issue, it is important to note the type of pornography he or she has been viewing.

For example, media that depict sexual acts are more intense and graphic than photographs of individuals wearing little or no clothing. Some pornographic material is violent or involves children. If you become aware of any viewing, purchasing, or distributing of child pornography, contact civil authorities. A help line is also available for the bishop in dealing with this issue.

11. How, When, and Why: Talking to Your Children about Sexuality

12. Teaching How to Be Sexually Pure and Prepared

13. How I Learned to Understand God’s View of Sexuality

Quotes About Marital Intimacy

Some persons have supposed that our natural affections were the results of a fallen and corrupt nature, and that they are “carnal, sensual, and devilish,” and therefore ought to be resisted, subdued, or overcome as so many evils which prevent our perfection, or progress in the spiritual life. In short, that they should be greatly subdued in this world, and in the world to come entirely done away. And even our intelligence also.

Such persons have mistaken the source and fountain of happiness altogether. They have not one correct idea of the nature of the enjoyments, or happiness of heaven, or earth; of this life or any other…

Our natural affections are planted in us by the Spirit of God, for a wise purpose; and they are the very main-springs of life and happiness—they are the cement of all virtuous and heavenly society—they are the essence of charity, or love; and therefore never fail, but endure forever.

There is not a more pure and holy principle in existence than the affection which glows in the bosom of a virtuous man for his companion; …

The fact is, God made man, male and female; he planted in their bosoms those affections which are calculated to promote their happiness and union.

These pure affections are inspired in our bosoms, and interwoven with our nature by an all wise and benevolent being, who rejoices in the happiness and welfare of his creatures. All his revelations to man, touching this subject, are calculated to approve, encourage, and strengthen these emotions, and to increase and perfect them; that man, enlightened and taught of God, may be more free, more social, cheerful, happy, kind, familiar, and lovely than he was before; that he may fill all the relationships of life, and act in every sphere of usefulness with a greater energy, and with a readier mind, and a more willing heart. – Essential Parley P. Pratt

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We have a great many principles innate in our natures that are correct, but they want sanctifying. God said to man, ‘Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.’ (Genesis 1:28.) Well, he has planted, in accordance with this, a natural desire in woman towards man, and in man towards woman and a feeling of affection, regard, and sympathy exists between the sexes. We bring it into the world with us, but that, like everything else, has to be sanctified. An unlawful gratification of these feelings and sympathies is wrong in the sight of God, and leads down to death, while a proper exercise of our functions leads to life, happiness, and exaltation in this world and the world to come. And so it is in regard to a thousand other things. – John Taylor

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The lawful association of the sexes is ordained of God, not only as the sole means of race perpetuation, but for the development of the higher faculties and nobler traits of human nature, which the love-inspired companionship of man and woman alone can insure. – Joseph F. Smith

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Within the enduring covenant of marriage, the Lord permits husband and wife the expression of the sacred procreative powers in all their loveliness and beauty within the bounds He has set. One purpose of this private, sacred, intimate experience is to provide the physical bodies for the spirits Father in Heaven wants to experience mortality. Another reason for these powerful and beautiful feelings of love is to bind husband and wife together in loyalty, fidelity, consideration of each other, and common purpose. – Richard G. Scott

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Tenderness and respect—never selfishness—must be the guiding principles in the intimate relationship between husband and wife. – Howard W. Hunter

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Intimate relations were designed by the Lord as a sacred opportunity to renew marriage covenants, provide therapy, and keep you two in love. It is essential in a stressful world that the two of you enjoy your physical and emotional relationship. Intimacy is not to be abused. This is your spouse, companion, confidant, lover, and therapist all rolled into one, and you two should enjoy the privilege of sharing your masculine and feminine traits in a wholesome way. – Douglas Brinley

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Physical intimacy is not only a symbolic union between a husband and a wife—the very uniting of their souls—but it is also symbolic of a shared relationship between them and their Father in Heaven. He is immortal and perfect. We are mortal and imperfect. Nevertheless we seek ways even in mortality whereby we can unite with Him spiritually. – Jeffrey R. Holland

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Addressing Concerns

The following responses to frequent concerns about pornography use is intended to provide truth over error. While some of the facts listed below dispel frequent false claims about pornography viewing, this is in NO way support for viewing pornography. Rather, these facts are here to provide hope and clarity, and calm the very real fears youth and adults have about the potential consequences of prior porn viewing, which are almost always inflated.

Viewing pornography contributes to sexual crime

This is a very common theory cited frequently both in literature and by people in general. The reasoning is often along the lines of “viewing porn gives men ideas and fantasies, so that they will then go out and assault a woman to play out their fantasies.” Sometimes you will even hear studies cited about the prevalence of a history of pornography use by sexual offenders. There are several problems that firmly establish this as a myth, not a fact.

1. The official Bureau of Justice Statistics reports that there was more than a 60% decline in sexual violence against females from 1995 TO 2010! - Female Victims Of Sexual Violence, 1994-2010

https://www.statista.com/statistics/191226/reported-forcible-rape-rate-in-the-us-since-1990/

Many claim that the access to high speed Internet pornography have increased sexual crimes exponentially, but there is NO research or statistics that confirm these opinions. These claims are often made in opinion articles published in official journals. For example the opinion article The Public Health Harms of Pornography: The Brain, Erectile Dysfunction, and Sexual Violence in "A Journal on Sexual Exploitations and Violence" is often quoted as a "study", but in fact is not a study. These are often well intended individuals trying to create urgency around this topic by using fear, not facts.

While some of their concerns about sex crimes being underreported are valid, the lack of data is not an excuse to insinuate, fabricate or use fear to retain a narrative. It's crucial to find ways to improve the data and make wise and informed decisions off that data. However, the fact that ALL crime according to the FBI has reduced since the early 1990s seems to demonstrate consistency in the data. Crime in the United States by Volume and Rate per 100,000 Inhabitants, 1993–2012

Furthermore, the fact that sex crimes have significantly decreased could be indicators that SOMETHING is working. By focusing on a narrative over facts, significant harm can be done to protecting woman and children. The drop in crime against women and children also doesn't reduce the importance of making the internet a safer place.

Finally, studies about sexual offenders and their pornography history is an example of confusing correlation and causation. Pornography viewing rates for males vary widely between surveys from near 50 percent (often for older males) to nearing 100 percent (for younger males). With these types of rates, it would be statistically surprising that most male criminals didn’t have a history of pornography usage; however, despite these rates, sexual offenders make up just .00279 percent of the population in the United States and its territories.

2. Someone having fantasies does not mean that he or she is going to act on that fantasy. This is just as true for sexual fantasies as it is for all those fantasies we may have about work, recreation, or life. Statistics for rape fantasies among women (typically of being raped) are reported at being between 31 percent and 57 percent, and for men (typically of raping a woman) are between 13 percent and 54 percent. Women's erotic rape fantasies: an evaluation of theory and research

No one thinks that 50 percent of women actually want to be raped in real life, nor that 50 percent of men want to actually rape a woman in real life. So the idea that engaging in fantasies, even fantasies of violent or heinous acts, will result in people following through with those acts is patently false.

3. Some people will push back on this and say that just because not everyone who watches porn engages in sexual assault doesn’t mean that porn doesn’t result in an increase, albeit a smaller one, in those crimes. This is also demonstrably false.

The introduction of the internet in the late 1990s can be considered the largest experiment on this issue to likely ever take place. Prior to the internet, access to pornography was generally limited to either Playboys or similar magazines that depicted nudity but not sexual activity or to videos that had to be ordered by mail, purchased at a sex shop, or rented from the local video rental store. The introduction of online pornography has increased access and use exponentially as it is now accessible easily, without cost, and, practically speaking, anonymously.

According to the claim that porn causes one to be more likely to commit sexual crimes, the dramatic increase in consumption of pornography due to the internet should have resulted in an measurable increase in sexual crimes. Instead, we have seen the opposite. The Federal Bureau of Justice Statistics shows a decline in the number of sexual assault victimizations of females from 1995 to 2010 by 58 percent. In other words, the amount of sexual assaults against women has gone down by almost 60 percent with the introduction and proliferation of internet pornography. A number of other studies have been done on the link between sexual crime and pornography availability, and they almost exclusively show a decrease in sexual crimes with a few showing negligible impacts. Pornography, public acceptance and sex related crime: A review

Porn will make people treat women as objects

This is a very common accusation, and often is accompanied by claims that the pornography viewer ends up viewing all women as inanimate objects with no emotions or feelings at all. It is an emotionally charged concept and can be difficult to talk about. What makes this myth particularly difficult to address is that in some ways it is true. Let’s start by defining objectification.

Ob·jec·ti·fi·ca·tion \əbˌjektəfəˈkāSH(ə)n\ noun: the action of degrading someone to the status of a mere object.

The definition of objectification is notably lacking specific reference to both sexuality and to women. There is a reason for that: objectification happens in all sorts of aspects of life. Dr. David Ley commented on this phenomenon.

Nobody wants to be seen as merely an object. We all want to be seen as a person, a unique being, with our own thoughts, feelings, needs, and desires. But, as usual, sexual objectification is, for some reason, treated as especially “wrong” compared to other types of objectification.

Our society, in fact, thrives on objectification. You don’t think telemarketers REALLY care about you as a person, do you? Objectification is not necessarily a bad thing. Surgeons commonly “objectify” their patients because it is easier to cut into them when the surgeon is not distracted by thoughts of this person’s feelings, future and past. Soldiers objectify their enemies to make it easier to attack or kill them. What do we tell a person who is afraid of public speaking? “Imagine your audience naked…”.

He then explains the other side to sexual objectification.

Research with pornography and objectification has actually shown that when we see someone as a sexualized “object,” there are some good sides to that. When we are sexualizing someone, we tend to see them as someone who experiences things in a powerful way. We see them as “experiencers,” who we can imagine “experiencing” sex with us. There was an old study years ago where people thought they were giving electric shocks to other people. Current studies on sexual objectification suggest that if that person were showing more skin, or was even naked, people would shock them less. Not because they want to get laid by that poor person, but because we believe, on the basis of that sexual objectification, that they would feel the pain more intensely than other people.

This is a far cry from the idea that objectification amounts to women being seen as a chair or a treadmill to be used for our enjoyment without consideration at all. In fact, Joshua Knobe, professor of philosophy and cognitive science at Yale University, notes that objectification isn’t really an accurate term for what is taking place. He and some colleagues conducted an experiment about objectification by giving male participants a picture of a woman who is either clothed or nude and posed normally, or nude and posed sexually. They then had participants rate the woman on how capable they thought she was of having agency (self-control and both planning and acting morally) and how capable she was of having experiences (feeling fear, desire, and pleasure). Based on their results, they found that men believed the woman posing naked and in a sexy pose was seen as having less agency but more experience than the woman who was just naked or clothed posing normally. From that data, they deduced that,

In short, it doesn't look like pornography is leading men to treat women as mere “objects.” Instead, we seem to be getting something that might be called animalification—treating a woman as though she lacks the capacity for complex thinking and reasoning, but at the same time, treating her as though she was even more capable of having strong feelings and emotional responses.”

Again, this is not the same as truly objectifying someone and seeing them as “an object.” Rather, as Knobe later puts it, “the problem here doesn't have to do with ignoring a person's mind but rather with focusing exclusively on just one part of that mind.”

This is something that we all engage in even during a sexual experience with a spouse. When we find ourselves moving towards orgasm and wanting our spouse to continue doing what they are doing or to just hold still for a moment or to stop something distracting because we are close to the point of climax, we are objectifying them, seeing them in that moment in the context of our own self rather than as a full person who may not want to stop what they’re doing. Hopefully though, when that moment of objectification has passed, we re-engage with them, attend to their needs, cuddle, and draw close again. In this way, objectification is functional similar to the way it is functional for a surgeon or soldier.

Yes, in consuming pornography, we only see part of a person. This isn’t a problem specific to pornography, it is simply an aspect of how we all function in various aspects of life and one that can, when taken to an extreme, be incredibly problematic. So we are then left with the question of whether the objectification in the context of pornography consumption devalues women uniquely in real life. And the answer is no.

In 2016, researchers from Ontario tested this theory. Specifically, they wanted to measure how pornography use impacted the attitudes of egalitarianism in men. They measured egalitarian attitudes toward women holding positions of power, women working outside the home, abortion issues (including under conditions like rape), and attitudes around the traditional family. What did they find? Those who used pornography held attitudes that were more egalitarian than those who did not use pornography. In other words, rather than pornography consumption being correlated with negative attitudes about women, it was correlated with positive, egalitarian ideas about women.

The idea that pornography objectifies women in any way that is unique from objectification that happens generally in life or is harmful to attitudes about women is a myth.

Viewing pornography will corrupt your sexual interest

There is no arguing that pornography will expose someone to sexual acts, behaviors, and ideas that they might not otherwise have. Viewing and even repeatedly seeking out this material has lead some to the idea that such exposure is ruining or corrupting their sexuality, perhaps even irreparably. Reasoning often accompanies the idea that the person is becoming “satiated” and developing a “tolerance” to more mainstream pornography and requires increasingly “intense” or “shocking” material to get aroused. Such a thought is quite frightening and consequently creates enormous concern. Fortunately, research has shown this to be completely false.

Over 2,000 people who identified as consumers of pornography were surveyed in this research. Fifty-eight percent were women and a little less than half were in a relationship. The survey asked them how arousing they found each of 27 different categories of pornography covering a broad range of mainstream and non-mainstream interests. While some identified as being aroused by non-mainstream pornography, they were also aroused by mainstream pornography. They also didn’t report being any less sexually satisfied than those who did not report being aroused by the non-mainstream pornography. This shows that consumption of pornography will not corrupt your sexual interests and cause you to not be interested in more mainstream sexual stimuli. It shows a lack of evidence (the closest science comes to disproving something) for the idea of satiation and tolerance in pornography consumption.

With that said, those who do view pornography often find themselves aroused by new things. The research discussed above would note that this is not a corruption of sexuality since mainstream sexual stimuli is still arousing. Rather, it is a discovery of increased breadth of sexual interest.

The most common way to conceptualize this broadening of interests is as a lovemap, which was developed by psychologist John Money in 1980. He and others have expanded on it ever since. The lovemap is the sum of those thoughts, ideas, fantasies, situations, traits, etc. that make up what we find to be seuxally arousing. The formation of this template begins with the hormones we are exposed to at birth and continues up into puberty. Money notes that the most vulnerable and critical years for lovemap formation is not teenagehood when sexual hormones are raging but rather the formative years of about five to eight years old. And after puberty, the lovemap has largely been formed and is extremely resistant to change.

John Money, a prominent psychologist and sexologist, introduced the concept of a 'lovemap' to describe the mental blueprint that shapes an individual's sexual desires and preferences. Born in New Zealand in 1921 and later working in the United States, Money was a key figure in the field of sexual identity and development. His groundbreaking work at Johns Hopkins University, where he was influential in the establishment of the first gender identity clinic, contributed significantly to the understanding of gender identity and sexual orientation.

Money's concept of a lovemap encompasses a variety of mental images, ideas, fantasies, situations, and traits that collectively define what one finds sexually arousing. He proposed that these lovemaps begin forming early in life, shaped by an interplay of biological, psychological, and social factors. Contrary to a sole focus on hormonal influences, Money emphasized the importance of early childhood experiences and societal interactions in the development of these sexual templates. He believed that while lovemaps start forming in childhood, they become relatively stable and resistant to change after puberty.

In counseling, explaining lovemaps can be akin to describing a subconscious sexual scrapbook, unknowingly compiled from a diverse array of sexual and erotic experiences. This scrapbook, though created without conscious awareness, forms the foundation of an individual's sexual identity. Gaining insight into its content, however, is not straightforward. It requires exploration, openness, and a certain level of sexual confidence. While individuals may have some awareness of their sexual preferences and fantasies, much of their lovemap remains unexplored, making self-discovery a key aspect of understanding one's sexual identity.

John Money's theories, including his work on lovemaps, have been influential in the fields of psychology and sexology. They have sparked considerable discussion and debate, contributing to a deeper understanding of human sexuality and its complex interplay with psychological and social factors.

The privacy and anonymity of pornography can expose the viewer to aspects of sexuality that they may not have explored yet. They can browse for taboo topics, fantasies, or imagery that they might otherwise not be able to explore. Whether that is going to end up being sexually arousing to them or not is based on their lovemap. They are essentially flipping to that page in their sexual scrapbook and finding out, “Wow, there’s a of great stuff that I like on these pages,” or “There are a couple of interesting things here, but not a ton of stuff,” or even “Huh, I don’t have any pages about that in my scrapbook.”

Once you find certain pages, you may end up spending time learning more about that, exploring there, diving into those pages; however, pornography exposure will not add pages to your scrapbook or tear pages out. It just might point out pages that you hadn’t really spent much time on before. In other words, viewing pornography isn't corrupting sexual interests; people are using pornography to explore the sexual interests they already have.

According to Matthew 5:27–28, lusting is evil.

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You heard it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery,’ but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman/wife in order to covet her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. Matthew 5:27–28

Probably one of the most misinterpreted Bible scripture used to teach chastity, biblical scholar Jason A. Staples (Ph.D., UNC-Chapel Hill), who is a historian of early Judaism and Christianity, has observed in his article “Whoever Looks at a Woman With Lust”: Misinterpreted Bible Passages. Why misinterpreting this scripture is particularly dangerous;

The biggest problem with the way these verses are usually explained is that it misplaces the focus away from the will, from the commitment of the heart, towards a condemnation of the natural desires human beings are created having. Young men in many churches are effectively told that there is something inherently sinful in their sexual impulses.

As a devout Latter-day Saint, and Therapist who works primarily with sexual health and compulsive porn and sexual behavior, I have also seen the very real danger of Latter-day Saints misinterpreting this scripture in a way that harms them as individuals and harms their marriages. Jason A. Staples's observation hits home in a profound way. In reading the following you might be surprised to know he is not LDS. But he is addressing the danger of this misinterpretation to a general Christian audience. Beyond semantics and misinterpretation, he points out four major reasons why misinterpreting this scripture is harmful;

1. A great deal of self-defeat and guilt about sexual desire is a problem in much of the church. Young men are often entirely consumed with their efforts “not to lust,” as though focusing even more attention on the matter of sexual desire would actually help things!

2. In the same vein, I have even had married men talk to me about how they try not to “lust” for their wives! This stems from the misguided idea that if their desire for sex is simply because they’re “horny,” there’s something inherently wrong with that, something to feel guilty about. (In contrast, look at the way Paul approaches marital sex in 1 Cor 7; he seems to present it as the necessary and acceptable cure for “being horny.”) Talk about a way to take some of the joy out of marriage and substitute defeat and guilt!

3. Many young men simply give up the fight, reasoning that if they’re already guilty of sexual sin because of their thoughts, they might as well go ahead and enjoy the real thing. You’d probably be surprised how often this is the case.

4. Some who understand this passage to be a condemnation of lust actually reason that they can have extramarital (or at least premarital) sex as long as they “don’t lust.”

Staples continues by saying that we, unfortunately;

…emphasize this verse to men and (especially) adolescent boys, warning that if they so much as think of a woman in a sexual manner, they’ve already sinned, that they’ve already effectively done the deed with her. Such an interpretation often works hand-in-glove with the common idea that Jesus “intensified” the Law in the Sermon on the Mount, setting a higher standard in order to show that no person could actually live up to God’s standards, showing that a person could only be saved by recognizing the impossibility of righteousness and then receiving forgiveness (a complete misinterpretation of the Sermon on the Mount I will address at another time). So the common teaching is: lust (that is, sexual lust) is absolutely evil—equivalent, even, to the physical act of sexual sin.

Another key aspect of nearly all the common misinterpretations of this verse is a specific (mistaken) definition of the word “lust.” Specifically, many readers understand “lust” as specifically denoting misplaced or overly robust libido. For example, as one recent conversation partner explained to me, “I take lust to mean wanting something more than you should in an unhealthy way.”

Despite its popularity, this interpretation is imprecise, even flat wrong, and leads to surprisingly harmful consequences, making this verse a great candidate to start this series.

Staples continues by examining the nuance and significance of this misinterpretation by stating;

… the Greek word usually translated “lust” in this passage (ἐπιθυμέω; epithumeô) is precisely the word for “covet” (Hebrew חמד) in the Tenth Command in the Septuagint (Greek Old Testament), which says:

‘You will not covet your neighbor’s wife. You will not covet your neighbors house or his field or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or any animal which is your neighbor’s. (Ex 20:17 LXX)’

Looks pretty familiar, doesn’t it? In fact, it’s essentially identical; since there’s no distinction between the words “wife” and “woman” in Greek, the word translated “wife” here is the same that is translated “woman” in Matthew (both English words translate the same Greek word γύνη; gynē).

It turns out that Jesus isn’t saying anything new at all in Matthew 5:27–28. Instead, he directly cites one of the Ten Commands to remind his audience that the Law not only prohibits adultery, it prohibits coveting with the same severity. This is not an intensification of the Law; it’s a reminder of what the Law already says. In addition, Jesus gives no indication that he regards the Law as too difficult to keep—he not only assumes that his followers can follow his interpretation of the Torah but commands them to do so.

Now that it’s clear that Jesus isn’t saying something specifically new here but is instead calling attention to the Tenth Command, the next order of business is to understand the tenth command and the concept of “coveting.” The first thing to understand is that when the Hebrew חמד or Greek ἐπιθυμέω are used as verbs in the OT, it denotes desire directed at obtaining the specific object in question and not merely the existence of the desire itself.

Strikingly, the nominal (noun-form) concept of “lust” or “desire” (even the sexual variety) is nowhere forbidden in Scripture, nor is it equated with sin—only the potential to sin: “Each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. Then, when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin. And when sin is completed, it brings forth death” (James 1:14–15). Note that James clearly distinguishes between “lust” (that is, desire) at the stage of temptation and “sin,” which is the actual commission of an act.

Pornography is as addictive as drugs.

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There is NO evidence that pornography is as addictive as drugs.

This myth is a result of fear-based media and well-intending people to emphasize the potential dangers of porn use. Often the media and certain 'experts' will quote from neuroscience research to support their statements.

For example, one of the most widely misused/misquoted study is the 2014 Dr. Valerie Voon study, "Neural Correlates of Sexual Cue Reactivity in Individuals with and without Compulsive Sexual Behaviours" which even the Church used to emphisize the 'danger' of porn viewing, in a press release that included "a call of action to parents," and that "letting children consume pornography freely was likeleaving heroin lying around the house, or handing out vodka at the school gates.” Cambridge Study confirms Danger of Pornography

However, this is NOT what Dr. Valerie Voon research found and,

“Voon is quick to caution against using her studies to leap to conclusions about the addictiveness of sex or porn. ‘Much more research is required,’ she explains."

Additionally other neuroscientists at the University of California, Los Angeles,

"observed that volunteers who believed they had a problem with porn reacted to the pictures with low levels of excitement in the brain, unlike other addicts faced with triggering cues.” These people may be having problems, but of some other type,” says Prause. “Addiction is not a good way of understanding it.” Can you really be addicted to sex?

What Dr. Voon study actually says is the following;

The current study has multiple limitations.

1. the study involved only (19) heterosexual male subjects.

2. there currently exist no formal diagnostic criteria for CSB and thus this represents a limitation for understanding the findings and placing them within the larger literature.

3. given the cross-sectional nature of the study, inferences about causality cannot be made.

4. the small sample and lack of a whole brain corrected approach is a limitation.

The current and extant findings suggest that a common network exists for sexual-cue reactivity and drug-cue reactivity in groups with CSB (compulsive sexual behavior) and drug addictions, respectively. These findings suggest overlaps in networks underlying disorders of pathological consumption of drugs and natural rewards. **While this study may suggest overlaps with substance-use disorders, further clinical studies are required to determine whether CSB should be categorized as an impulse-control disorder, within an obsessive-compulsive spectrum or as a behavioural addiction.

In more recent interviews, Dr. Valerie Voon has stated after having conducted more research that she

... takes a more moderate view. “I suspect (porn) probably doesn’t cause a ‘major’ cognitive risk,” she says in an email to The Daily Beast. But she adds there are potential issues with porn consumption for especially vulnerable populations. “I think one of the main issues would be that there may be a subgroup of people who may run into problems with compulsive use.”

Furthermore, Dr. Cameron Staley, LDS scientist and leading expert in the subject, has studied porn addiction his whole career and has stated that NO research supports porn addiction. In one interview he made the following observation;

“I believe the Adversary attempts to convince us that, ‘You are horrible, that you should never tell anybody, never reach out for help, don’t even use the Atonement, don’t talk to anybody—he wins. We shut down. We withdraw,” Staley says. “But if we view it as, ‘Oh wow, I’m doing something that’s inconsistent with my beliefs, let’s understand what’s going on, the Atonement still applies to me. I’m not a bad person, I’m just doing things that I don’t want to do.’”

According to Staley, religious people feel distress when viewing pornography “as high as other people that are viewing at really high rates,” even if they don’t view it as often. Through his research, he has also discovered that believing you are “addicted” may maintain unwanted pornography viewing in the future. “Believing you’re addicted takes away the hope, and when we don’t have hope, we do things to soothe ourselves, and the one strategy these individuals have come up with to soothe themselves is viewing pornography,” Staley says. “That’s the cycle.”

Finally, some professionals have embraced the fear-based side of porn use as a core part of their business model.

What about all the science that supports sex/porn addiction?

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The topic of sex/porn addiction and its validity is a complex topic, which is too often overly-simplified and forced into being an absolute - such as being an addiction or not.

“Addiction” is an overused term that has morphed into a general description of any impulsive behavior. But “addiction” has a very specific meaning in science and mental health. As a result, the general use of the term has caused much confusion. However, the confusion is not an issue of semantics alone. If it were semantics alone, this would not be a cause of concern. Rather, the issue is in applying effective methods and solutions; it goes to the core of accurately identifying the problem and the treatment.

For example, imagine going to the doctor and saying you have cancer, and the doctor immediately starts chemo and other invasive forms of cancer treatment. This treatment goes on for days, months, and years, only to discover you don’t have cancer at all. Some will exclaim, it's because you’re cured! Others will say the cancer is still there because you still feel sick. You go another round of chemo and invasive treatment. Some will say, well cancer is so dangerous that whether you had cancer or not, what could the chemo hurt? You might be thinking there is a malpractice case developing here since the doctor only relied on a personal report, failing in his duty to do his own diagnostics and assessments. You’d be right.

However, this is at the core of the problem with sex/porn addiction treatment. There is no robust standard for assessment. The Sexual Addiction Screening Test (SAST) is almost entirely subjective and moralistic (“moral incongruence”) and relies almost entirely on personal assessment and reports. Not an empirical assessment.

Why is a moral incongruence bad? It’s important to consider our core values, including our religious values/faith, and commitments/covenants while assessing sex/porn addiction. However, if the assessment is done through the lens of morality, that individual will most likely self-assess more severely.

For example, if one perceives viewing porn with eternal consequences (a form of betrayal and adultery), that individual will most likely assess more severely than someone who does not view their porn use in the terms of morality. Ergo, the same treatment is given for an individual who viewed an Instagram model on occasion versus an individual presenting with frequent, out-of-control, prolonged exposure and engaging in illegal and risk-taking behavior.

Research on the moral perception of sex/porn and its impact on perceived behaviors is well documented:

• Damaged Goods: Perception of Pornography Addiction as a Mediator Between Religiosity and Relationship Anxiety Surrounding Pornography Use

• Moral Incongruence and Pornography Use: A Critical Review and Integration

• Addiction or Transgression? Moral Incongruence and Self-Reported Problematic Pornography Use in a Nationally Representative Sample

Furthermore, the addiction model is essentially a one-size-fits-all approach, with variations depending on the treatment center. More effective treatment centers and approaches include assessment for comorbid diagnoses, but the treatment is usually the same.

ARP or Addiction treatment is the best way to recover or stop porn use.

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The best and most current research on sex/porn addiction does not support the addiction model of treatment. The addiction model has been well studied and has been shown to have a success rate between 5-10%, which is less than doing nothing at all for treatment.

In one of the most comprehensive analyses of various alcohol abuse treatments, AA ranked 37th out of 48 treatment methods. It was well behind the most effective methods, which were brief interventions, motivational enhancement, and GABA agonist medication, but also well behind even such minimal interventions as case management (12th), acupuncture (17th), exercise (20th), and the no-intervention-at-all method, simply labeled self-monitoring (30th). —Saving Psychotherapy: How Therapists Can Bring the Talking Cure Back from the Brink by Benjamin E. Caldwell

If you are one of the 5-10% success rates, wonderful! The desire for improved treatment from porn use in no way discount the 5-10%. (Also, see; “The Sober Truth" and “Sex Addiction a Critical History”) Rather it’s impairative to find a way for MORE people to experience the success of those few in addiction treatment.

As Latter-day Saints we have an impairative to save souls. If you were given a more successful aproach, or if you were aware of a better way to treat porn use. Avoiding years of struggle that resulted in years of suffering being avoided. Wouldn't you do all you can to bring that to the many souls craving for more meaningful and lasting solutions? As such many trained professionals tend to suggest more effective treatment like A.C.T. or ACT-based treatment over the LDS Church’s Addiction Recovery Program (ARP), or other addiction-based models of treatment. Additionally, both “the science” and the “LDS Church” agree in discouraging the use of the addiction language and approach.

The Science: The most current and comprehensive scientific review of sex/porn addiction: Sexual addiction 25 years on: A systematic and methodological review of empirical literature and an agenda for future research

The LDS Church: What LDS Apostle Elder Dallin H. Oaks has said about porn “addiction” which is also in line with the scientific research:

In earlier times and circumstances, our counsel about pornography focused principally on helping individuals to avoid initial exposure or to recover from addiction. While those efforts are still important, past experience and current circumstances have shown the need for counsel addressed to levels of pornography use between the polar extremes of avoidance and addiction. It is helpful to focus on four different levels of involvement with pornography: (1) inadvertent exposure, (2) occasional use, (3) intensive use, and (4) compulsive use (addiction).

…

Once we recognize these different levels, we also recognize that not everyone who uses pornography willfully is addicted to it. In fact, most young men and young women who struggle with pornography are not addicted. That is a very important distinction to make—not just for the parents, spouses, and leaders who desire to help but also for those who struggle with this problem. Here is why.

First, the deeper the level of involvement one engages in—from inadvertent exposure, to occasional or repeated intentional use, to intensive use, to compulsive (addictive) use—the more difficult it is to recover. If behavior is incorrectly classified as an addiction, the user may think he or she has lost agency and the capacity to overcome the problem. This can weaken resolve to recover and repent. On the other hand, having a clearer understanding of the depth of a problem—that it may not be as ingrained or extreme as feared—can give hope and an increased capacity to exercise agency to discontinue and repent.

Second, as with any sinful behavior, willful use of pornography drives away the Holy Ghost. Some who have experienced this will feel prompted to repent. Others, however, may feel embarrassed and seek to hide their guilt through deceit. They may also begin to feel shame, which can lead to self-loathing. If this happens, users may begin to believe one of Satan’s greatest lies: that what they have done or continue to do makes them a bad person, unworthy of the Savior’s grace and incapable of repentance. That is simply not true. We are never too far out of reach from the Savior and His Atonement. — Recovering from the Trap of Pornography

Couple Highlight: Nich and Kelsey

This post is part of the series, “Couple Highlights.” Each Couple Highlight was originally shared in the Improving Intimacy in Latter-Day Saint Relationships Facebook Group, which is a private group. In order to share these posts publicly on danielaburgess.com, explicit written consent was granted by each couple.

Couple Highlights began on the Facebook Group as a way to hear about the growth happening for couples in the group, and to give them an opportunity to share their story--their marriage journey, where they are at, and the challenges they’ve overcome.

Hi! Whenever we are asked to introduce ourselves the first thing that comes to mind (for Kelsey), is “well we’re pretty normal I guess?” Pretty soon into thinking of details to share, though, we remember that while Kelsey is born-and-raised from Provo UT (pretty standard) and we met in the MTC, bound for the same mission (also not unheard of and surprisingly common these days), Nich is a convert from the Midwest with tattoos XD. I (Kelsey) forget sometimes that we might not appear typical to most people in Provo, UT (where we live). Another aspect of our lives that may provide some insight into why we are the way we are is that Kelsey works full time and Nich is a full-time student and at-home dad.

I guess you could say we hit it off as missionaries, but we also served in a pretty strict mission (under Elder Choi, see the talk “Don’t Look Around, Look Up” from the April 2017 General Conference), so we weren’t all flirty or particularly thought about dating each other while we were out serving. Because we were in the same MTC district, Kelsey got home about 6 months before Nich, in July 2016, and that’s when we started writing. We were engaged by the following Easter. We’re pretty confident that the mission president’s wife at the time shared a photo of us with the missionaries when we started dating, and not just to some missionaries, but probably in a zone-conference PowerPoint. It’s fun to have our mission memories in common and we find ourselves laughing about and reminiscing over many mission things together.

We have been married since August of 2017 and have one child who is just over 2 years old (yes, she was born before our first anniversary – by eight days!). Something some of you may know about us is that Daniel Burgess is Kelsey’s step-father. So, obviously, that’s how we were introduced to the group. We’re both really grateful for Dan’s perspective and the conversations he’s helped us have, as they have made it easier to navigate the tough conversations needed in every marriage.

Speaking of tough, while there are many things we feel are healthy and good about our relationship, we both struggle pretty majorly with mental illness. Nich has depression, suicidal thoughts, and ADHD, and Kelsey has high anxiety. You can imagine these things pair great with each other, amiright? Nich has had a sense that he needed help since he was a teenager, but the first time he got professional help was from the LDS family services therapist associated with our mission. He hasn’t had an official therapist since then, but has been on Wellbutrin on and off since we’ve been married. He still struggles to know how to handle his mental health problems consistently. As for Kelsey’s mental health journey, she loves to soak up information and get advice from others, so she has dived in to several podcasts since we’ve been married. One of the first ones was Dan’s, of course, and she has also found a lot of resonating concepts from Amanda Louder’s Live from Love. She’s currently loving Awesome With Alison (comment if you love her too!) and working with a therapist recommended by Dan. Together, we try to be really open about our struggles, and have conversations about how we can help each other often. It’s not easy to be dealing with, but we usually feel confident that we can work through things together.

When it comes to sex, you can imagine how a high-anxiety person and a person struggling to see meaning in life (depression and suicide ideation) might have difficulty feeling in-sync when it comes to connecting intimately. If either of us are feeling stressed or particularly overwhelmed by thoughts and emotions, sex isn’t a priority until we have talked and re-connected emotionally. For both of us, emotional connection is an extremely important aspect of not only general intimacy, but sex as well. We probably block ourselves from feeling like being intimate because we over-analyze where we are emotionally and get caught in our own thought-traps.

Because of everything described here, we are grateful to be able to participate in this group and have had a lot of mind-opening conversations about ourselves and our relationship because of the questions and opinions posed here. We’re both pretty active in the group and are of course willing to answer any further questions anyone has!

Couple Highlight: John and Katie

This post is part of the series, “Couple Highlights.” Each Couple Highlight was originally shared in the Improving Intimacy in Latter-Day Saint Relationships Facebook Group, which is a private group. In order to share these posts publicly on danielaburgess.com, explicit written consent was granted by each couple.

Couple Highlights began on the Facebook Group as a way to hear about the growth happening for couples in the group, and to give them an opportunity to share their story--their marriage journey, where they are at, and the challenges they’ve overcome.

Hey! We’re John and Katie Salmond. We have been married for almost 15 years. We both grew up in homes where we were not educated about sex. Shame was paramount in my home in particular (Katie). We were lucky to read a few books during our engagement that helped us identify our cultural and parental taught shame around sexuality and fight against it. We have been quite lucky that we have not had tons of shame around our sex life. Sexuality and intimacy groups are a place for me to find my people, learn, get ideas of fun things to try and get recommendations about books.

We have experienced a few health challenges that have shaped our intimacy and sex life though.

We have had long-term infertility. Facing the possibility of never having children, re-imagining our family structure and navigating intimacy crushing treatments has bound us, helped us to turn inward as a couple and strengthened us. Our life became about us as a couple and being fulfilled and putting our relationship first. When we did have our one son, our couple relationship has remained our priority.

We have also worked to manage the challenges that mental illness brings. John has drug-resistant depression resulting in low/no desire. I had postpartum anxiety with intrusive thoughts. It has made it so we have had to very clearly communicate wants and desires, schedule sex and stick to each other. Our couplehood is our home base. It’s what has gotten us through so much.

Couple Highlight: Daniel and Julie

This post is part of the series, “Couple Highlights.” Each Couple Highlight was originally shared in the Improving Intimacy in Latter-Day Saint Relationships Facebook Group, which is a private group. In order to share these posts publicly on danielaburgess.com, explicit written consent was granted by each couple.

Couple Highlights began on the Facebook Group as a way to hear about the growth happening for couples in the group, and to give them an opportunity to share their story--their marriage journey, where they are at, and the challenges they’ve overcome.

My wife and I will begin by sharing our Couple Highlight.

Hello! We are Daniel and Julie Burgess. We’ve been married for eight years. We have three married daughters, two living in Provo, and the other living in France working for Disney Paris. Our two sons are currently living with us. The oldest son is preparing for his mission and the younger son has one more year before he starts high school. We have one grandchild, and we’re loving getting used to the titles “grandma” and “grandpa”.

Daniel has a background in Finance, and currently works as a marriage and family therapist specializing in intimacy issues. I love sharing the joy that comes from my work as an author, podcaster, and presenter. I also find great joy in getting lost in my books; church history, LDS scholars, the writings of our prophets, etc.

Julie recently retired from teaching school, and is excited to get back on stage. I love performing in theater and spent 25 years performing in shows along the Wasatch front. I have written several published pieces of choral music, conducted numerous choirs, and taught voice for many years. I also love my wall of power tools, and relish a good project!

We love studying and discussing the gospel, remodeling our homes, weightlifting, hiking, and traveling. We’ve paddled kayaks in Mendocino, Alaska, Utah, and Nova Scotia.

Since each of us were previously divorced, we knew going in that we’d be facing as yet unrevealed triggers and dysfunctions. Many of these issues were rooted in the behaviors from our previous marriages. It affected the way we communicated with each other, and the way we perceived the meaning of each other’s words and actions. We have had many long (sometimes tearful) discussions as we’ve navigated these bumps. Being willing to actually talk out loud about our fears and misconceptions has made it possible for us to be more vulnerable with each other, and has definitely increased the depth of our relationship.

Having both grown up in the church, we’ve struggled with the way sexual/morality topics were taught in our teenage years. We have both strived to teach these important concepts in a better way. In our house, we wanted conversations about desire, arousal, and intimacy to be normalized. We’ve had open discussions with our kids at the dinner table and sitting together in the hot tub.

As parents of married kids, we’re grateful that they feel comfortable discussing questions about intimacy and the role it plays in their relationships. This is a huge difference from the way we were raised, where we would have never brought up these topics with our own parents. We love to see how the members of this group encourage each other and help each other understand differing points of view. It’s so wonderful to see the conversation about intimacy within LDS relationships change in such a healthy and supportive way!

Is Masturbation A Sin?

Is Masturbation A Sin?

1. In-depth and detailed history of masturbation in the LDS Church: https://www.danielaburgess.com/blog/2018/01/dont-touch-addressing-sexual-taboos-in.html
   

2. Misinterpretation of Lust: https://www.jasonstaples.com/bible/most-misinterpreted-bible-passages-1-matthew-527-28/

3. LDS Medical Historian Lester Bush observed that church in; 

   “The late 1920s and most of the 1930s saw a more explicit “sex education” in church lessons, to a degree not matched before or since. As one invited speaker explained to a general conference of the Relief Society, adults needed to realize that “you and I have been brought up in a generation where we just could not talk about sex. Not so our youngsters. They are talking and thinking about sex as frankly as anything else, and so far as I can discover, as wholesomely. Official [church] manuals advised members to purchase secular works on the subject-specific titles were suggested--and that the expression of sexual interests ‘should be guided and directed, not inhibited.’ An apogee (in the Mormon context) was reached in lessons which warned against creating emotional problems in adolescent children by an ‘unintelligent’ over response to the discovery that they practiced masturbation.” Health and Medicine among the Latter-day Saints: Science, Sense, and Scripture by Lester E. Bush, Jr pg. 144

4. 3The Lester Bush quote above comes from the Relief Society Mag 1932 pages 89-93, the who section is absolutely amazing https://archive.org/details/reliefsocietymag19reli/page/n101/mode/2up?q=sex

5. “Rhetoric from the pulpit at Church conferences has changed over time on the issue of sexual immorality. Very little was said about this topic in the Church’s first century . . . American society began its own transformation in sexual values . . . in the post-World War II baby boomers. The value of chastity was cast aside in favor of sexual liberation. LDS Church leaders reacted by emphasizing more often and more strongly from the pulpit the value of chastity.” —E. G. Swedin Swedin, E. G. (2003). Healing souls: Psychotherapy in the Latter-day Saint community. University of Illinois Press. pg 155-6

6. LDS Church Relief Society President Amy Lyman Brown Health article on not overreacting to masturbation which can be found at my site: https://www.danielaburgess.com/blog/2018/09/the-unintelligent-parent.html or here: Relief Society Magazine: Guide Lessons For April 1927 Lesson IV Social Service (Fourth Week in April).

Book Review: Period Repair Manual by Lara Briden

Period Repair Manual Review

Purchase Here

The Improving Intimacy book recommendation and reviews are written by Latter-day Saints giving a gospel-centered perspective. This book review is provided by both Kelsey Henry and Julie Burgess. They both have very positive things to say about the “Period Repair Manual” by Dr. Lara Briden. Which is one of our most popular book recommendations.

Kelsey Henry says:

I give this book 5 stars!! I learned about Dr. Briden's research from my parents, who attended the Rocky Mountain Sex Summit in November 2019 where she was the keynote presenter. The first thing that caught me about what my parents were sharing was her claim that hormonal birth control (The Pill and hormonal IUDs, mostly), is majorly messing with women's health. I have been struggling with anxiety for most of my life, and it's been pretty bad recently. I also have very bad excema. I of course I wondered if those were among one of the many issues caused by hormonal birth control. I wouldn't describe my "wonder," however, as a hopeful one that looked forward to more information. No, when I read what my parents were sharing, I was quite upset. "Well, I'm screwed." I thought. "So it's either have all these terrible health issues or have children when you aren't planning on them. Great." If that's your initial reaction to the information Lara is sharing, never fear! This book will help you understand your options.

While the book is titled "Period Repair Manual," another title for it could be "Join the Period Revolution!" It talks about more than just PMS and bleeding. I learned what women's health should ideally look like, from everything to period regularity, to diet, to emotions. If you've ever wondered about birth control and its effect on your body and emotions, I highly recommend this book! A few dollars is a GREAT investment in your overall health, and she freely shares loads of research as well as the very same methods she uses with her clients. A period is a vital sign of a woman's health, and Dr. Briden is here to teach you why, along with HOW to help your period be what it needs to be. You'll learn about her approach to all types of periods: non-existent, late, early, heavy, painful, mid-cycle bleeding (yes, it's a thing), and many more. She talks about PMS and getting rid of the stigma that being "hormonal" is bad, as well as the notion that your periods don't have to cause such bad PMS that it prohibits you from enjoying your normal daily activities. She teaches you why and how to love your period. If that seems totally crazy, but you'd like to give it a try, read the book! I wish I had known about it sooner and now I feel strongly I should share it with every woman!

Julie Burgess Says:

You know how when your heart is searching for answers, they come at you from many different places at once?

When I started this blog, it was because I was in search of something that worked. And I thought I'd found the answer in the Paleo lifestyle. Unfortunately, over the years, that success didn't last. No matter how carefully I crafted our Paleo meals, I was gaining fat. So, I turned to macro counting. And for a while, that worked -- until it didn't.

I wasn't sure what was going wrong. I had my bloodwork done. I worked out harder. I increased my protein and decreased my carbs and fats. I weighed and measured and tracked.

BUT I WAS ALWAYS HUNGRY.

I was incredibly frustrated. I felt that someone who works out as hard as I do, who eats as healthy as I do, should be lean and strong. My body fat should be lower. If anything, I should be able to maintain, not watching the number on the scale and the measuring tape go up -- not getting too big around the waistline for my clothes. In addition, my digestive troubles had returned. My trouble with constipation became a daily battle, despite all the vegetables and the fluid intake. I worried that it was out of my control, due to my menopausal body. Or maybe my estrogen patches were to blame. Or perhaps there was an unseen problem, linked to my family history of diabetes and hypothyroidism, and breast cancer. But I didn't want to be doomed to a pudgy middle! I want the way I look on the outside to reflect the things I feel are important on the inside.

Last month, we brought all our kids (and one grandkid!) together for Thanksgiving. I had a great conversation with my son-in-law (Ballerina's husband) about nutrition. He asked lots of questions with great enthusiasm. One of the things he asked struck me deeply -- he wondered what I would change about my current eating habits if I didn't have such strict restrictions on my macros. My answer wasn't that I wanted to sit around eating chocolate or chips or ice cream. I just wanted to add a piece of toast with breakfast. I wanted to not be afraid of oatmeal. I wanted to be able to eat an entire piece of fruit, instead of only being allowed to eat half. Most of all, I wanted to stop feeling hungry all the time. My meals were tasty, but not satisfying. It never felt like enough food.

During that week, Ballerina talked with me about intuitive eating -- about honoring my body's hunger, and not being afraid of food. I was nervous about that, but there was something in the idea that gave me hope.

Then I started reading Period Repair Manual, by Lara Briden. Even though I've had a hysterectomy, I found her book riveting. My uterus and ovaries were removed in 2008 due to endometriosis. There wasn't much research to guide me to other alternatives then. But I thought perhaps her research could still help me.

I started to think about the fact that the human body is remarkably self-healing, with the right circumstances. A few years ago, I cut off the tip of my finger while chopping chard. The doctor at the ER stitched it back on, but my exit instructions weren't very clear. I thought I was supposed to keep the ointment and gauze on my finger until I came back for stitches-removal. I changed the dressing each day, but I kept it carefully bandaged and splinted for two weeks, as I believed I'd been instructed. After two weeks passed, my finger was just as gross and soft and unhealed as the day I cut it. The nurse who saw me told me I was supposed to expose it to air. She told me to come back in a week, and to leave the bandage off. In just a couple of days, my mushy finger started to heal. It was pretty yucky looking for a while, and the nerves still aren't 100% the same, but I didn't lose my finger.

Could I create the right circumstances for my body to heal? Why is it storing fat? Why isn't it eliminating waste? Why am I hungry all the time, in spite of eating plenty of satisfying protein and vegetables?

Dr. Briden writes:

Hunger is normal, natural, and healthy. Hunger is how your body gets the nutrition it needs ... Don't fight your hunger. Instead, honor it by giving your body substantial, satisfying meals.

Later, she cautions against viewing certain foods as dangerous:

Please do not fall into the trap of becoming too rigid or fearful of food. That can lead you into a downward spiral of undereating or being afraid to eat out or visit friends.

It was as if she were speaking directly to me. She goes on to discuss the need for carbohydrates:

You deserve to feel satisfied and be fully nourished. As a woman, you need more food than you've been led to believe.

The more I read, the more I realized -- I haven't known how to create the right circumstances. Armed with better information, perhaps now I can. I'm all done measuring and weighing and tracking my macros. I'm all done feeling hungry all the dang time. Ignoring hunger is not a virtue. Hunger is your body's signal that it requires fuel. Starches are not evil. Potatoes and oats and bananas are not scary foods.

Over the past couple of weeks, I've been nervous that I would pile on the pounds now that I'm not restricting my food intake. But it hasn't happened. I feel happier. And I feel hopeful.

Betrayal Trauma and Recovery

Betrayal trauma is disheartening and destructive. It is critical to be a trauma informed therapist when working with clients who have been abused.

I will never forget the evening I met with ‘Devon’ and ‘Emma’, a couple seeking support for “communication issues.” The moment they sat in front of me I knew something wasn’t right. Only those who have experienced the insidiousness of covert narcissisms and gaslighting can understand and appreciate what I saw in this couples’ dynamic. But it was simultaneously so subtle and pervasive, that it felt surreal and nauseating. Immediately, I requested to meet with them separately. Devon, as I expected, was reluctant and frustrated. I was not surprised that Emma responded uncomfortably. Those who have been in Emma’s shoes know how risky it is to have their abuser separated in these situations. What proceeded over the next few weeks and months was a carefully laid out action plan to protect and support Emma from ten years of emotional and spiritual abuse.

Prior to meeting with me, the husband had leveraged meetings with ecclesiastical leadership as ‘counseling’ in order to perpetuate his abuse. He knew his leadership was not trained to identify abuse, and so he was able to manipulate his ecclesiastical leadership. Unfortunately these loving Bishops who thought they were promoting a healthy relationship were perpetuating an environment of abuse. One of the ways the husband manipulated his leadership was that he convinced them to have him present at all meetings with his wife; this allowed him to control the narrative by fabricating, gaslighting and embellishing detailed lies. The only reason why Devon and Emma finally came to a marriage therapist was because their current Bishop was at his wits end and didn’t know what else to do after years of repeated issues. Devon reluctantly decided to see a counselor, at the insistence of his bishop, but purposely chose a male therapist—assuming he could ‘win’ me over. Fortunately for the wife, I have been trained in and have experience identifying abusive behaviors.

Navigating this discovery of abuse was a fragile line to walk as a therapist. If Devon knew I was on to him, he could invent an elaborate lie to either switch therapists or stop seeing a therapist altogether. Inherently, as a therapist and a human-being, I desired the safety and well-being of Emma. In short, I’m happy to say that Emma was able to eventually distance herself from the husband, heal, and learn to see and identify these dangerous behaviors. It wasn’t a fast and easy process for her, but I am happy to report that she is now thriving, self-aware, and learning how to live within healthy boundaries.

Betrayal trauma—and abuse of any kind—needs to be taken seriously and navigated by those who are experienced with this type of abuse. What is so dangerous about emotional abuse, spiritual abuse, and betrayal is that it is hard to put your finger on it. The abuser usually has spent years crafting lies and stories, leading the abused individual to struggle with identifying reality. If you feel you are in a relationship like this, trust your gut. Additionally, I would recommend reading Dr. Susan Forward’s book Emotional Blackmail which I’ve linked at the end of the article. You can also find a summary of the book’s concepts here: Emotional Blackmail website: Out of the F.O.G.

For the Ecclesiastical leaders, friends, and family reading this: you can support your loved ones by learning as much as you can about how to identify emotional, spiritual, and betrayal abuse. There is a significant amount of research and information available now and I’ve linked to some of those resources at the end of this article. While there are many good resources, there are also significant amounts of really bad and dangerous information. Unfortunately, there are many betrayal trauma therapists and support groups, which I believe are well-intended—but they fail to adequately distinguish abuse from maladaptive relationships.

Over the years I have worked with many couples who have experienced betrayal. There are few things in a relationship that are more devastating than to discover your loved one has been unfaithful. Fortunately for a large majority of those I've worked with, the betrayal and abuse have not been as severe as Devon and Emma’s, and not only was healing experienced but a thriving marriage became possible.

However, for those couples who struggled to experience healing and eventually separated—there was one common factor. Even with all the complexities involved in betrayal and recovery, the consistent factor in each case was the wife* was seeing a "betrayal trauma" therapist or following a betrayal trauma support group. More specifically, when the betrayed partner views the betrayal in the context of betrayal trauma theories, the betrayer is villainized with little or no opportunity to improve, change, or repent of their behavior. Furthermore, the couple is further divided with little to no skills learned or acquired in order to overcome and work together through the betrayal successfully.

*I emphasize “wife” here not to perpetuate stereotypes, but to reflect on the fact that the large majority of these support groups are female-centric.

As an advocate of support groups, I'm a huge believer in finding groups to help navigate a variety of mental health issues. However—from my professional experience and research—it appears that for a majority of betrayal trauma counselors and support groups, the good they are offering is too frequently drowned out by toxic or harmful views. In a recent broadcast by “Rethinking Porn Addiction,” Nate and Angilyn Bagley share their personal experience with betrayal along with some of the best experts on the topic. They discovered how viewing their partner through a betrayal trauma lens was doing more harm than good for them individually and as a couple.

I am sure there are exceptions out there, but from a deep dive into multiple programs and interviews, there is a visible pattern of skewed and misrepresented psychology. Some groups and/or individuals have even outright declared that only women can experience betrayal. In most cases these groups escalate trauma in the wife, promote unhealthy stereotypes, and demonize the husband. I want to be clear—I am not categorically saying all betrayal trauma therapists and groups are harmful, but caution must be used in what resources and therapist to use. In a podcast with Anarie we discussed the benefits of betrayal trauma work and how to find the right resources; learn more here: Betrayal Trauma: Anarie's Journey and Betrayal Trauma: Anarie's Definition of Success.

The psychological construct that is often in these groups is taught as a dogmatic narrative. The husband can never be good enough and regardless of the husband’s desire to heal and improve—they are viewed as gaslighters, narcissists, and horrible people. Although we are never responsible for other’s behavior, these groups promote a discouraging concept that husbands have no right to be hurt or negatively influenced by the wife's abusive behavior. These groups for the most part do not educate or encourage improved relationship behavior, rather cold and harsh criticism under the guise of “boundaries”. In fact, I am confident that anyone who has been through betrayal trauma counseling will label this very post as arrogant, manipulative, and gaslighting.

The term ‘gaslighting’ has almost completely lost its meaning due to various definitions or uses ranging from the wide and loosely applied description given to anyone accidentally misspeaking, to identifying literal gaslighters whose entire purpose is to make one feel and believe they are sick and crazy. The term ‘gaslight’ has become a catch-all phrase and is weaponized to the point that people accuse others of gaslighting because they disagree with them. Other terms like narcissist and sociopath are quickly becoming overused to describe people who experience any emotion differently. My heart breaks over seeing mothers in these betrayal trauma groups refer to their difficult teenager as ‘gaslighting’ and struggling spouses attempting to emotionally connect as abusers. The sad irony is that those who misuse the term ‘gaslighting’ are often the ones doing the very thing they are labeling and accusing others of doing.

Alfred MacDonald has one of the best explanations of the misuse of gaslighting, in his article, “Gaslighting: what it isn’t”:

If you wish to apply gaslighting to a set of behaviors, simply discrediting someone’s emotions doesn’t qualify as gaslighting. The litmus test for gaslighting by all authoritative definitions has been a dishonest and manipulative attempt to deny reality to the person on the receiving end of gaslighting. So, for example, an attempt to make that person believe that actions which most certainly happened haven’t actually happened. You can understand how some people would get the impression that calling someone crazy qualifies as this, because someone could say “you’re crazy, that never happened” — but merely telling someone they are being dramatic does not qualify as abuse, in any way, nor does telling someone they are being too sensitive qualify as abuse on its own.

Let me reiterate: no matter what you define gaslighting as, telling someone they are being dramatic or too sensitive or that they can’t take a joke in no way, shape or form qualifies as abuse on its own. Even repeatedly. There must be an aspect of denial of a factual event integrated with the accusations of oversensitivity.

To clarify what I mean by “denial of a factual event”, I have constructed a set of examples to distinguish between actual gaslighting and not gaslighting at all.

Actual gaslighting: A wife witnesses her husband cheating on her. He starts an ongoing campaign to make her believe this event was false and that her perception of reality is incorrect. “No, you’re crazy.” When she insists that she saw what she saw, he retorts with “why are you being so emotional?”

Not gaslighting: A husband repeatedly tells jokes that offend his wife. “Why are you being so sensitive?”, he asks. “You take offense to things way too easily.” She starts to doubt her own judgment — but not because of any abusive reason.

Actual gaslighting: A boyfriend and girlfriend are having an intense argument when he hits her repeatedly. Several days later, she calls the police, but there is no proof. He insists that she is delusional to the police. When she confronts him about this in private, he insists that she imagined it, and repeatedly calls her crazy for recalling the event. She begins to doubt her own memory.

Not gaslighting: James is dating Rebecca, whose political ideology he opposes. James frequently comments on Rebecca’s articles with dramatic and overblown emotional language. Rebecca insists that he’s being overly emotional, and that he should stop doing that. He says she’s trying to diminish the importance of his point by gaslighting him.

Actual gaslighting: A son witnesses his mom snorting meth in the pantry, when he previously did not know his mom did drugs at all. Since this event is so anomalous, he has a hard time believing it. She insists that he imagined it — she was just dusting the pantry. But since this image was so vivid, he insists he believed it. She starts to discredit his statement, saying that he is delusional, that he is too emotional, and that he doesn’t have a grip on reality. He begins to doubt his own sense of reality and she uses this as a basis for additional lies.

Gaslighting: what it isn't

It is heartbreaking to see couples who have experienced heartache and betrayal get led down a path of escalating trauma from support groups who claim to help individuals heal from trauma. For example, ‘Jason’ came to me, weighed down by his guilt that he was having romantic thoughts of another woman at work. There was never any inappropriate conversation, nor inappropriate behavior on his part. However, while at work one day he was wondering why he was feeling attracted to this coworker which led him to a series of thoughts that made him realize how distant he and his wife had become over 20 years. He craved meaningful conversations and felt dismissed by his wife a lot. On many occasions, he attempted to open his heart to her but she never engaged. Knowing he needed to figure out how to reconnect with his wife ‘Laural’, he decided to bring her to counseling. They quickly made connections with some basic guidance and psychoeducation. With some minor and expected difficulty, both Jason and Laural were on a path to a new and improved relationship. However, what success they gained was quickly reversed when Laural’s individual counselor told her she was betrayed by Jason and that he had had an “emotional affair.”

Laural and Jason went from rekindling love and flourishing in weekly date nights to Laural setting firm boundaries and impossible expectations. Over the course of a year, Laurel’s behavior would escalate to spying on Jason, accusing him of seeing this coworker, and reporting to authorities that she was concerned he might kill her and the kids. Jason was not, nor had he ever been, a violent person. Aside from mild to high frustration with work and raising kids, he has never been aggressive in any way to indicate she or the kids were in danger. But because Laural had been learning about covert narcissism and how the “good guys” are the most dangerous, she began to view Jason through a distorted lens. Any time Jason attempted to meet Laural’s expectations, he was accused of manipulating her. Whenever he failed to meet Laural’s expectations, she accused him of not caring.

While each relationship is different, Laural and Jason's example is not the exception or rarity. Both Jason and Laural had very different communication styles and they both came from very different family cultures—but they were two great people who had an opportunity to change and improve their relationship. Instead of viewing Jason’s humbling discovery as an opportunity to reset and rediscover each other, his discovery was viewed as an impossible obstacle to overcome. It’s essential to learn healthy boundaries, identify red flags, and to NEVER tolerate abusive behavior. But it is equally important to learn healthy marital connection, vulnerability, and recovery; which help identify red flags and establish healthy boundaries. These can be taught parallelly in a productive way. Focusing on betrayal only increases toxic behavior from both partners, in a self-fulling way. Focusing on recovery only runs the risk of ignoring dangerous behavior.

Marriage and parenting are, in my opinion, two of the most ill-prepared activities we humans engage in. Yet we demand our spouses to be expert communicators, lovers, and partners. When marriages get tough, many couples seem to expect far more from each other than they ever have examples of doing. It doesn’t matter what 20-plus years of family origin culture, triggers, and poor coping skills each has lived with—couples demand so much, so quickly, with little or no understanding of how to have to a good marriage. Furthermore, couples often have a skewed or unrealistic view of what a healthy loving marriage looks and feels like.

Betrayal should never happen—and there are definitely individuals who are narcissists and need to be cut off—but the large majority, at least in my experience, of those who experience betrayal in some way are good people and/or couples who have suffered from years of unhealthy communication, clashing of family cultures, poor understanding of sexual health, and a lack of knowledge for how to get quality help. Everyone deserves an opportunity to heal and thrive. Great marriages can leverage difficult experiences, including betrayal, to reshape their partnership into something more positive than they ever knew could happen. I have seen it repeatedly.

Again, I am not discouraging all betrayal trauma groups or therapists. I’ve spoken to a few who have found great value in these resources, without allowing it to become the lens they viewed their spouse through. They equally pursued engaging and healthy improvements—as a team—in their marriage.

If you have had a positive experience with a betrayal therapist or group, I would appreciate your referral/recommendation so I can add to a list of trusted therapists.

If you’re interested in learning more about recovering from betrayal or other hurtful relationship problems in a healthy way, please feel free to reach out.

Meet with Daniel

Schedule Daniel for a presentation at your Ward, Stake or Conference.

Additional resources:

Summary of Book and additional resources: 

1. Here is a summary of the book: "Emotional Blackmail" patterns.  

2. Find the full book here: Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You 

3. Emotional Blackmail website: Out of the F.O.G.

4. Real Love: The Truth About Finding Unconditional Love & Fulfilling Relationships

5. Daring Greatly: How the Courage to Be Vulnerable Transforms the Way We Live, Love, Parent, and Lead

When do I say yes to marriage?

Copyright © 2017 Daniel A. Burgess, MA LMFT. All Rights Reserved. “Marriage Readiness Questions” danielaburgess.com Copyright

When do I say yes to marriage?

"The best way to avoid divorce from an unfaithful, abusive, or unsupportive spouse is to avoid marriage to such a person. If you wish to marry well, inquire well. Associations through 'hanging out' or exchanging information on the Internet are not a sufficient basis for marriage. There should be dating, followed by careful and thoughtful and thorough courtship. There should be ample opportunities to experience the prospective spouse’s behavior in a variety of circumstances" (Dallin H. Oaks, "Divorce," Ensign, May 2007, 70–73).

There is no magic crystal ball to determine if you and your partner are ready to marry. However, there are healthy ways to help assess your readiness for marriage. When I use the term “readiness,” I am more referring to the probability of success. Because truth be told no one is “ready for marriage.” Even among the best of friendships, marriage is challenging. But if you can enter that sacred union with the right tools, awareness, and trust, those challenges can be lighter. The following is a tool to determine one’s readiness for marriage, which has been used by each of my daughters and countless clients. Take note that I am emphasizing “readiness.” This is NOT a tool to determine if you or your partner should say “yes”.

There are 3 sections to the questions; 1. Self-readiness for marriage (18 questions), 2. Should WE get married (13 questions), 3. Future of marriage (7 questions). These are not intended as “yes” or “no” questions. If you complete these questions in a few minutes or even an hour, you are not using the tool to its full potential. It also could mean there is avoidance to the questions. If you struggle to go deep with the questions, how can you expect to connect with yourself and your partner, and navigate the complexities and challenges of marriage? Take your time, be meditative and prayerful as you reflect and ponder each question.

It is my belief and experience the first section is the MOST important to reflect on. If you do not understand yourself — if you don’t have a solid grasp of your own identity as a child of God and as a unique individual — what then are you bringing to the marriage? How will you keep from losing yourself, becoming enmeshed, when life challenges are thrown at you and your relationship? In nearly every struggling relationship I have worked with I hear the following phrase, “I no longer know who I am.” Sometimes I hear “I never knew who I was…”. These were/are good people, faithful individuals who lost their identity in the relationship.

Take your time in sincerely pondering each question.

1. Self-readiness for marriage:

   1. Do I enjoy being alone or do I have the constant need to be with my partner?

   2. Do I enjoy being with my partner or am I often looking forward to having time without my partner?

   3. How do I define my happiness and who I am right now?

   4. How does getting married change that definition?

   5. What does it mean to me to be married?

   6. What are the advantages of being single?

   7. What are the advantages of being married?

   8. What are the disadvantages of being single?

   9. What are the disadvantages of being married?

   10. Am I happy with who I am; spiritually, physically, emotionally, intellectually while I am alone?

   11. Am I happy with who I am; spiritually, physically, emotionally, intellectually while I am in a relationship?

   12. Does loving my partner inspire me to be a “better person”, to seek a stronger individual relationship with the Savior?

   13. Do I feel like my partner makes me a “better person” while I am with him/her? (This is a potential warning sign of codependency and controlling behavior, or an inappropriate dependence on another to feel motivated to be better.)

   14. Is my relationship greater with Christ and Heavenly Father than with my partner?

   15. What scares me about marriage?

   16. What excites me about marriage?

   17. Am I pushing aside fears, anxieties, and feelings of being overwhelmed regarding marriage by admonishing myself to have greater faith?

   18.  Do I ever feel like I have to hide or pretend I am not feeling/experiencing an emotion?

"Bruce C. Hafen has compared relationships between men and women to a pyramid. The base of the pyramid is friendship, and the ascending layers include building blocks such as understanding, respect, and restraint. At the very top is what he terms a 'glittering little mystery called romance.' If one tries to stand the pyramid on its point, expecting romance to hold everything else up, the pyramid will fall ("The Gospel and Romantic Love," Ensign, Oct. 1982, p. 67)" (Jonn D. Claybaugh, "Dating: A Time to Become Best Friends," Ensign, Apr 1994, 19).

2. Should WE get married:

1. Are you able to completely share all your dreams and desires with your partner?

2. Do you find yourself deferring to your partner for decision making, ideas, and interests? (Potential of losing one’s individuality)

3. Are you able to openly, lovingly, maturely, and respectfully discuss sex with your partner prior to marriage?

   1. What is your sexual history: knowledge, understanding, experience?

   2. What do you imagine or believe physical intimacy will be defined as or acceptable in your relationship?

   3. What do you feel is appropriate or not appropriate sexual behavior?

4. Are you able to share all addictions (out of control behavior, weaknesses, and perceived flaws) safely and without reservation with your partner?

   1. Do you or have you struggled with drugs/substances (whether legal or illegal)?

   2. Do you or have you struggled with any sexual issues:

      1. Do you or have you struggled with pornography?

      2. Do you or have you struggled with masturbation?

      3. Do you or have you struggled with persistent inappropriate thoughts?

   3. Do you or have you struggled with financial issues?

      1. Do you or have you struggled with gambling?

      2. Do you or have you struggled with debt?

      3. Do you or have you struggled with gaming?

   4. Do you or have you struggled with anger?

   5. Do you or have you struggled with lying?

5. Are there things that you are not open about because you feel it’s been resolved, it’s history, or has been repented of, or believe will not be a problem going forward or in marriage?

6. Do you ever feel you have to withhold opinions, silliness, thoughts, dreams, personality, fashion, or creativity from your partner?

7. Do you feel you need to apologize for your partner’s actions or behaviors?

8. Does your partner’s behavior or actions ever embarrass you?

9. Does your partner ever treat you in such a way that you feel ashamed or embarrassed?

10. Have you been open about your mental health history?

    1. Trauma?

    2. Medications?

    3. Recurring issues?

11. Do you believe and feel your partner is completely open and transparent in all their thoughts, feelings, actions, and emotions?

12. Are you friends? Or are there miscommunications, disagreements, and lack of connection?

13. Do you have a “testimony” of your relationship and marriage; a peaceful and clear heart and mind? (If someone were to ask you, “How do you know the gospel is true?” you would likely respond, “I just know,” or “I have a testimony,” or “I have felt a witness of the Holy Ghost.” The answer to “How do I know if I should marry?” is “You just know.” The Holy Ghost will witness it to you as clearly and strongly as He did when witnessing the truth of the gospel to you.)

(Be cautious if you are tempted to dismiss stupors of thought, concerns, anxiousness, lack of clarity, etc. as lack of faith or fear. Anxiety or stupors of thought or a lack of peace and clarity are some of the tools of the Holy Ghost to help us identify unwise choices. Fear is very different; one can be very clear in mind and heart and fear the decision. But if you are not feeling peace and clarity it is a witness that something is not right. Additionally, when it comes to marriage, if there is fear, that individual must either overcome that fear on their own with Father, or NOT marry. Entering marriage with fear will create resentment and problems. If someone other than Father “guides” you or “helps” you through the fear, it is a form of self-betrayal and also has a high probability to create resentment in the marriage.)

"Choose a companion you can always honor, you can always respect, one who will complement you in your own life, one to whom you can give your entire heart, your entire love, your entire allegiance, your entire loyalty" (President Gordon B. Hinckley "Life's Obligations," Ensign, Feb 1999, 2).

3. Future of marriage:

1. What are your plans and goals beyond the wedding and reception?

2. What are your short term goals as a couple; temporal and spiritual?

3. What are your long term goals as a couple; temporal and spiritual?

4. Do you have individual goals; temporal and spiritual?

5. In what ways will you support each other’s dreams and aspirations?

6. If any of your or your spouse’s addictions or issues reoccur during the marriage, specifically how will it be addressed, handled and, if possible, overcome?

7. Will you be able to love, adore, and cherish your spouse even in what can be perceived as annoying behavior without the feeling need to change, criticize, tease, or complain?

Copyright © 2017 Daniel A. Burgess, MA LMFT. All Rights Reserved. “Marriage Readiness Questions” danielaburgess.com Copyright

Meet with Daniel

The Ideal and the Real: a Reading of Genesis 38 and Judah

Guest post by: Tyson Yapias

     All right, fellow Latter-day Saints, let’s have a talk about sexual sins and how we react to them. This is all brought on by this week's Come Follow Me lesson on Alma 39, which has been used as the preeminent scriptural text on how serious sexual sins are. I'm talking about Alma 39:5 "Know ye not, my son, that these things are an abomination in the sight of the Lord; yea, most abominable above all sins save it be the shedding of innocent blood or denying the Holy Ghost?" This verse has traditionally been used to equate sexual immorality next to murder.

Except, does it really mean what we think it means?
     I will go over this quickly, as I want to spend most of my time on another scripture passage instead, so I encourage you to read what Michael Ash wrote about Alma 39:5 HERE as well as what my friends at Book of Mormon Central have written about the same thing HERE. Their argument is basically this: Alma was not necessarily equating sexual immorality to the sin next to murder. Rather, that leading others into apostasy is practically "murdering their spirits" and thus that is the sin next to murder. We can see this in Alma 36:13-14 "yea, I saw that I had rebelled against my God, and that I had not kept his holy commandments. Yea, and I had murdered many of his children, or rather led them away unto destruction." Alma caused many people to go down the road of apostasy because he led them astray, and we see he considered his actions to be a form of spiritual murder. Turning to Alma 39 we see that Corianton "abandoned the ministry" (Alma 39:3, 4 & 16) and his actions with the harlot Isabel persuaded the Zoramites to apostatize ("when they saw your conduct they would not believe in my words." (Alma 39:11)). Thus, Corianton's sin was grievous not simply because he had a sexual encounter with a harlot (though, we should recognize that the text is not explicit that he actually did); but because of his actions with Isabel, the Zoramites recognized his hypocrisy and refused to believe the prophet. Mormon is quick to point out that the Zoramites' apostasy is the reason why the great war started (Alma 43:4-5). Their spiritual rebellion leads to social-political rebellion and a terrible military conflict for the Nephites, Lamanites, and Zoramites that lasts for 22 years.
     Just so I am not misunderstood, neither myself, BMC or Ash are saying that sexual sins are not serious. Sexual immorality in its many forms can have very profound, drastic, and grievous consequences; and ancient and modern prophets have consistently preached sexual purity as the Lord's standard.      Next, I just want to put this out there. When we discuss sexual immorality as Latter-day Saints we tend to weigh any and every sexual sin the same. I will not delve into this here, but if you ask me, pornography use is very different and distinct from pre-marital sex which is very different and distinct from having an extra-marital affair. The consequences and ramifications for each are different, yet we generally tend to lump them all together. My friend, Daniel Burgess, has contributed a lot to this conversation. Again, I don't have the time to get into it, so I will direct you to his blog HERE.
     At last, we get to the meat of what I want to talk about today: a reading of Genesis 38, the Joseph in Egypt Narrative, and a good look at the character Judah. I have to give a lot of credit to Ben Spackman for providing the foundation of this reading — in his blog on the Sunday school lessons he addresses Gen 38. I have built heavily on and expanded what he wrote. You can see some of what he has written HERE, HERE and HERE.

The Ideal and the Real: Joseph and Judah in Egypt

     Genesis chapters 37-50 are one cohesive story, but when we study it we typically cut it into two pieces, and we throw out Genesis 38 because it’s just weird. This, I think, causes us to miss the important story markers that connect the chapters at the beginning to the chapters at the end. Also, Gen 38 is one of my favorite chapters in the whole Old Testament because of what it does to Judah's character. I really think Judah is the hero of the story (the whole Joseph in Egypt story), a hero that we overlook because we only focus on Joseph. Judah represents the real human, while Joseph is an ideal human. I think we can all, and shouldn’t be ashamed, to see Judah in all of us.
      In Genesis 37 we are introduced to Joseph — the dreamer, and favorite of his father — and we also meet his jealous brothers. Joseph tells his family about his dreams. I think we tend to idealize Joseph and ignore how much of a brat he is about all this. Additionally, I think revenge is on his mind when he sees in brothers in Egypt, and not a "test to see if they changed". But that is an aspect of the story that I don't want to focus on for our purposes today. Joseph, after all, represents the ideal, so we can keep him that way. Joseph never does wrong, keep that in mind. When Joseph went out to the fields to visit his brothers, and they conspired to initially kill him, Ruben, the eldest son, persuaded them to just throw him in a pit (Genesis 38:20–22). Ruben is the oldest, therefore he is supposed to be the leader. But his leadership fails. It is Judah, though, who takes charge of the brothers and changes the plan. “What profit is it if we slay our brother, and conceal his blood? Come, and let us sell him to the Ishmeelites, and let not our hand be upon him; for he is our brother and our flesh. And his brethren were content” (Genesis 37:26–27).     Judah is perfectly content with selling another human being.
     Joseph is then sold as a slave. His precious coat is torn and presented to Jacob. The brothers ask Jacob to “know now whether it be thy son’s coat or no” (Genesis 37:32). The Hebrew root for the word “know” is nakar which means to know, recognize, discern.[1] This word is important as it’s the word the connects all the chapters together.     It is then in Genesis 38 that the story moves to Judah and Tamar. Some scholars have argued that this chapter represents an interruption in the Joseph narrative,[2] yet it has several prominent features that contribute to a unity of the larger narrative in Genesis 37–48. In Genesis 38, Tamar marries Er, the son of Judah. For whatever reason, God smites him and he dies. Following the not-yet-codified levirate law of marriage[3] in order to raise a child for the lost son Er, Tamar marries Judah’s next son, Onan. While the KJV beats around the bush, but the NRSV clearly states what his sin is (Gen 38:9 NRSV). Onan has sex with Tamar but pulls out in order to prevent her from having a child that would legally not be his. Thus, he too is killed by God. Judah, having lost two sons refused to give his third son to Tamar, “lest peradventure he die also, as his brethren did” (Genesis 38:11). Because Judah would not give his next son to Tamar, the duty of raising a child in the name of Er falls to Judah himself. To get Judah to fulfill his culturally acceptable obligations Tamar crafts a plan. She dresses up as a harlot and encounters Judah. He begins the negotiations to a sexual encounter, but since he has nothing to give her, Tamar requests his signet, bracelet and staff as a “pledge,” or “surety.” This is equivalent to what we would call a security deposit. They agree that Judah would later bring a goat to her as payment and she would return his signet, bracelet and staff.      Judah is perfectly content to buy another human being.
     Judah conducts his business, and Tamar goes her way never coming back to collect the goat. (An important detail connecting this chapter to the rest is that a goat is used in the deception plot, first to Jacob by the brothers, and now by Tamar to deceive Judah) Months later, when Judah finds out she is pregnant he summons her so that she may be executed by fire (Genesis 38:24). Yet, Tamar produces Judah’s signet, bracelet and staff and says “Discern, I pray thee, whose are these, the signet, and bracelets, and staff” (Genesis 38:25). Here we see the same root, nakar, translated as “discern.” These two instances are the only times this word appears in this same form in the entire Bible, and not by chance, this is a deliberate connection. We see the same root appear again in Gen 42:7-8, discernment is a theme running through all these chapters. Judah recognizes his error and pronounces a blessing for her and a condemnation for himself. “She hath been more righteous than I” (Genesis 38:26). This is a sincere recognition of his guilt. According to 1 Chron. 4:21 the first son of Shelah was named Er, thus supporting the notion that Judah did eventually let Tamar marry Shelah and that his first son was given to the line of dead brother thus fulfilling that law. Judah not only recognized his wrong, he accepted it and he corrected it.
     The next time we see Judah he is a completely changed person.
     The narrative then moves to Joseph in Egypt. First, he is in Potiphar’s house, where Potiphar’s wife tries to seduce Joseph (Genesis 39:12). This event is meant to be juxtaposed with Judah’s actions in Genesis 38. Often, Joseph is praised as the ideal that everyone should aspire to be like, since he flees from temptation. We are constantly taught to be like Joseph, especially in sexual matters. I don’t think there is necessarily anything wrong with holding this high ideal. However, I think we can see sometimes that when kids hear “be like Joseph” but then when they make a mistake they may think they can never go back to being like Joseph. This ideal standard is just not the reality for many good kids. On the other hand, Judah embodies reality. Everyone makes mistakes, even grave ones, yet there is still room for redemption. Let us continue.
     Joseph is then imprisoned until he interprets Pharaoh’s dream of the seven years of plenty and seven years of famine. Pharaoh promotes Joseph to be in charge of preparations for the famine. After the famine begins, Joseph’s brothers go to Egypt to buy food. Joseph recognizes his brothers, but they don’t recognize him (Genesis 42:7–8). The word nakar appears here again. During the first visit, Joseph takes Simeon hostage until they bring Benjamin to him (Genesis 42:20, 24). It is during Joseph’s tests of his brothers that we see the repentant man Judah has become.     Back in Canaan, the family runs out of food and they must go back to Egypt. Jacob does not consent to Ruben’s pleading to let them take Benjamin (Genesis 42:36–38). Again, Ruben is supposed to be the leader, but he fails a second time. It is Judah who successfully persuades Jacob to release Benjamin into his care. “And Judah said unto Israel his father, Send the lad with me, and we will arise and go; that we may live, and not die, both we, and thou, and also our little ones. I will be surety for him; of my hand shalt thou require him: if I bring him not unto thee, and set him before thee, then let me bear the blame for ever” (Genesis 43:8–9). Jacob believes he has lost two sons, yet Judah successfully persuades him to surrender a third son. This is juxtaposed with Judah's own actions regarding his sons and Tamar in Gen 38.     Back in Egypt, Joseph ensnares Benjamin in a plot. It is Judah’s heartfelt pleading (Genesis 44:18–34) that ultimately persuades Joseph to give up his ruse and reveal himself to his brothers. Judah has the longest monologue in the book of Genesis, thus his words are special. This is not the same Judah who used and abused other people in the past. He is a different, more noble man, because he recognized the gravity of his sins and repented. Where before, Judah was willing to sell and buy other people, here we see Judah is willing to put forward himself as the price or “surety” (another word that shows up here and Gen 38) for another person. Not only does he say he is willing to do so, but when Joseph ensnares Benjamin in the scheme, Judah demonstrates his complete willingness to become Joseph’s slave (Genesis 44:33). This is what finally makes Joseph break down and reveal himself. And they all live happily ever after.

     As a side note, this whole narrative is etiological in that it explains how the tribes of Judah and Ephraim (Joseph) become the tribes that rule over the kingdoms of Israel, and why Ruben loses out on the leadership role. So even from an exegetical perspective, the Bible recognizes that Judah’s change in character is the reason why the kings come from him.     Joseph is the ideal: never sin, always run from sin.     Judah on the other hand is the real. We do sin. It is not ok to sin, because sin separates us from God. But if and when we sin, things can be made good and right. The power of Christ’s atonement reaches even sinners. This is clear from ancient and modern prophets. This is why I think us saints can all appreciate Judah, and that we need to see him as the hero of the story. In different ways we are all Judah. And if people who suffer from sexual sins (and any sin really) recognize that the scriptures depict Judah in all his wickedness rising with grace, I think that can be inspiring. It is especially the sexual nature of Judah’s sin with Tamar that is most applicable for the purposes of the subject of Alma 39. Even if people sin, the world is not permanently ruined, the power of Christ's atonement is still in effect if those people will use it, because it is truly infinite. There are of course consequences, but things can still be made right. That is the reality of things. We can hold to ideals, and we should. At the same time, we must recognize the reality of this fallen world: We are all sinners and come short of the glory of God, and yet no matter what our sins are and despite all, we do it is through the grace of Jesus that we are saved.

Meet with Daniel

Guest post by: Tyson Yapias

Faithful member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Scholar, Chaplain, Marine and Soldier. I love Star Wars and Mormonism, as well as scriptural exegesis and theology.

[1] Francis Brown, S. R. Driver, and Charles A. Briggs, The Brown-Driver-Briggs Hebrew and English Lexicon (Peapody, MA: Hendrickson Publishers, 1997), 647–48.[2] Harold W. Attridge et. al., The Harper Collins Study Bible (Sacramento: HarperCollins Publishers, 2006), 62.[3] The Law of Moses codifies this in Deuteronomy 25:5–10.

Improving Intimacy Book Club with Guest: Dr. Jennifer Finlayson-Fife

Jennifer Finlayson-Fife has graciously agreed to join us FOR ONE HOUR ONLY to share her amazing insights and answer questions! The book club hosts will select a small number of questions for Jennifer to answer.

Here are the podcast episodes used for Book Club:

Ask A Mormon Sex Therapist, Part 16 - THE oft-cited Episode 16 that has positively impacted so many marriages!

Partner Desirability and High/Low Desire Dynamics

Virtue, Passion, and Owning Your Desire

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In this blog post, we have provided multiple ways to watch/listen to/read this interview:

1. Book Club Video Interview

2. Improving Intimacy in Latter-day Saint Relationships Podcast Episode

3. Book Club Video Transcript

The Full Transcript of the Podcast can be located here.

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Bookclub Video Transcript:

00:00 Ray: So carry on.

00:03 Jennifer: Okay, so should I just jump in with the...

00:06 Ray: Yeah, please.

00:07 Jennifer: Yeah, sure. The only event, I think, that isn't currently full is just one that we kinda last minute decided to do because we had an opportunity, a venue, which is doing The Art of Desire workshop in Alpine, Utah next week, a week from Thursday and Friday. So it's a two-day women's workshop. It's like my most popular course and workshop because it's a course focused on women's self and sexual development, and kind of rethinking the whole paradigm in which we've been inculturated, and how it really interferes with desire and development.

00:48 Jennifer: And so, it's a good one, it's, you know, it's taking my dissertation research into everything I've kinda learned since then. So that's in Alpine and we just posted the tickets for sale like three or four days ago, and we still have maybe 20 spots left, so if anybody is interested in it, you can get a ticket. On my website actually, on my homepage.

01:15 Ray: Wonderful. At this point, I have to admit that I did exactly what Ellen and I talked about that I wouldn't do, which is forget to mention that our other host tonight is Ellen Hersam, and... [chuckle]

01:32 Ray: So we've been accepting questions for the last 24 hours, and we had several that came in and we have picked three or four that we might get to, I don't know, however many we're able to get to tonight.

01:44 Jennifer: Sure.

01:44 Daniel: And Ellen, why don't you pick up and can you give us a question?

01:48 Ellen: Sure. Happy to jump right in. Yeah, so we've got a few questions tonight. We thought we'd start off with this one. It's, "There's often debate around sex being a need or not, and how neediness isn't sexy, and how sex being a need kills desire. Yet many view sex as a need, not in life-or-death sense, but because they need that healthy sex life, helps them be happier both individually and as a couple. If sex isn't a need," so there's two parts here, "if sex isn't a need, what does this say about David Schnarch's Sexual Crucible?"

02:24 Ellen: "If any marriage would be improved by a healthy, intimate sexual relationship, how can it be said that sex isn't a need? If sex is a need, is... In this sense of being able to achieve personal growth, if I understand how Schnarch views marriage or the corresponding increase in marital satisfaction or individual happiness, how can we talk about its importance without killing desire? Or making one partner feel like it's their duty, instead of something they're doing for themselves, to increase their own happiness? I feel like if the couple isn't working toward a healthy sexual relationship, they're leaving something good and positive on the table, and missing a wonderful opportunity."

03:07 Jennifer: Okay, it's a good question, although I think the questioner is conflating the issue of... Well, I mean they're using the word "Need" in a way that kind of complicates it. I think when I say sex isn't a need, what I... If I have said that, what I mean is it's not a drive, it's not required for survival. Right? So a lot of times, people try to pressure their partner to have sex with them by putting it in the frame that they need it, meaning...

03:38 Jennifer: And my issue with that is if you're gonna talk about need, need is a way of trying to pressure their partner to manage and accommodate you without sort of taking responsibility for what you want. That's why I don't like it. So if you're gonna talk about need, then I'm thinking more about the issue of survival, and nobody needs sex to survive, 'cause as I've said, if that were true, there'd be a lot of dead people in our wards. And...

04:03 Ray: Oh my goodness.

04:04 Daniel: Maybe that's a good thing. [laughter] [overlapping conversation]

04:10 Daniel: And so Jennifer, is what I'm hearing you say is, is more of a manipulative tone...

04:16 Jennifer: Yes.

04:17 Daniel: Tone? Okay.

04:18 Jennifer: Yeah, exactly. And as soon as you start trying to manipulate, which many people do this, the higher-desire person tends to do this... And men are given that script a lot, that they need sex and so on. But as Mormons, we should be the least prone to that idea because we are fine, from a theological perspective, with people going without sex for their whole lives. Okay? So, now that said, I think sex is a part of thriving. Intimate sex is a part of thriving. It's part of a marriage thriving, and I wouldn't so much say that you must have sex in order for a marriage to be good. I wouldn't... Also, I wouldn't say you need for a marriage to be good in order to have sex.

05:04 Jennifer: I'm just saying that marriage... Meaning good sex is a part of thriving, but good sex is not something you manipulate or pressure into place. And lots of people try and don't believe me when I say that. [chuckle] So we all want to be desired, but the hard thing about being desired is you can't make somebody desire you.

05:28 Jennifer: Desire is a grace. And the more we try to control it and get somebody to give it to us, the less desirable we are. And the more that it feels like an obligation, or you're having sex with your partner just to get them off your back, or to get them to stop bugging you, or moping, or you know, whatever, and even if you get the sex you still don't feel desired. And so it's tough, it's a tough business, because the very thing we want, we don't have control over getting, we only have control over how desirable we are. 06:04 Ellen: So part of their question that I think I wanna highlight a little bit, is they say, "How can we talk about its importance without killing desire?" So without...

06:13 Jennifer: Yeah, yeah, because people are talking about its importance as a way to manipulate often. Right?

06:18 Ellen: Mm-hmm.

06:20 Jennifer: Like they're just saying it like... I was working with a couple of recently, and it was sort of, you know, "I'm focused on this marriage growing, that's why I wanna try all these new things with you." And so, they are using the idea of their standing up for a good marriage as a way to pressure the other person.

06:37 Ellen: Yes, so not making it manipulative?

06:40 Jennifer: Yeah. And I think you can be standing up for a good marriage and a good partnership by dealing with yourself. Dealing with the issue of your desirability. That doesn't preclude you from talking about the sexual relationship, but a lot of us are, because it's so easy to do it as human beings, we're much more focused on what we think we need our spouse to do, either stop pressuring us so much, or get their act together and go to Jennifer's The Art of Desire course, or something. [chuckle]

07:12 Jennifer: I have sometimes the men go and buy the course and then, a day later they ask for a refund, 'cause their wife doesn't wanna go, but... [chuckle]

07:18 Ellen: Yes, that makes sense. [chuckle]

07:22 Jennifer: So they're pressuring more on what the other person needs to do, as opposed to, "What is my role in an unsatisfying sexual relationship?" And I don't mean to say you can't talk about it and address what your spouse isn't doing, but oftentimes, we're so much more drawn to what our spouse is doing wrong, than how we're participating in the problem, and it keeps people stuck.

07:52 Ellen: Yeah, and they mentioned right at the beginning, this neediness isn't sexy.

07:56 Jennifer: Exactly.

07:56 Ellen: So if somebody is approaching this conversation in a relationship about their desire to have sex, and being in a relationship, a sexual relationship, they could essentially be approaching it in this neediness. And I think it sounds like their question is, "How can I approach it and not be killing desire by this neediness, but also be addressing the importance of intimacy and sexual relationship in the marriage?"

08:23 Jennifer: It sounds maybe like I'm not answering the question, but you have to confront... 08:25 Ellen: Maybe I'm not. [chuckle]

08:26 Jennifer: Oh no, no, not you. I'm saying me 'cause I'm gonna say something that maybe sounds like I'm not answering it, but...

08:32 Ellen: Okay.

08:32 Jennifer: I think you have to kinda confront that you are using the frame of neediness to get the other person to take care of you. Right? So, "I feel so bad about myself, I feel so undesirable, I feel so depressed when we're not having sex, and so for the love, give it to me." Okay? So you can do that, you might even get some sex, but you're not gonna get a passionate marriage. You're not gonna get the experience of being on an adventure together where you try new things.

09:05 Jennifer: So you have to deal with the fact that marriage is not designed, in my opinion, and I see this, we kind of learn the idea that marriage is mutual need fulfillment, and that's the wrong model in my opinion. That it's not about, "You prop up my sense of self, and I'll prop up yours." Because that just doesn't work, it breaks down very quickly.

09:31 Ellen: Absolutely... [overlapping conversation]

09:33 Jennifer: Yeah, that's what's happening when you date, but it only lasts for those few months. Okay? [chuckle]

09:38 Ellen: Yeah. [chuckle]

09:38 Jennifer: Because it's a short timespan. In marriage, you really have to handle your sense of self. You have to sustain your sense of self. If you're approaching your spouse, if you can sustain your sense of self, you're approaching your spouse from the position of, "I desire you. I love you, I like you, I like being with you." And it's real. Not, "Do You Love Me? Do you desire me? Am I enough?" Because that's not... A lot of people when they say, "How was it?" They mean "How was I?" Right?

10:11 Ellen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

10:12 Jennifer: And people know that... They instinctively know what's actually happening. Are you touching your spouse 'cause you want them to validate you sexually? Are you touching them because you really do desire them, and find them attractive, and you can stand on your own, and sustain your sense of self? And a lot of us don't even track that's what we're doing.

10:35 Ellen: I think that goes to say a lot to what you had spoken about in your first podcast that we had linked to this book club, where you had done the role play, where you stood in for the husband and spoke what he would say to his spouse in that sexless marriage, but it was what you're saying here. He came across as, "This is what I need. This is where I stand."

10:57 Jennifer: Yes.

10:58 Ellen: And, "This is what I'm looking for. I love you. And this is where I'm at." It was less of, "This is what I... I'm in need."

11:05 Jennifer: Exactly.

11:05 Ellen: It was more important for our marriage.

11:07 Jennifer: That's right. He's talking about what he wants from a marriage, what he really is standing up for, but he doesn't sound needy.

11:16 Ellen: Yes. Yeah.

11:17 Jennifer: It's not about, "Hey, you have to give it to me. Please, oh please, oh please." It's like he's sustaining his own sense of self in that conversation.

11:26 Ellen: Yeah, yeah. I'd wanted to dig into this question. I'm not the one who wrote it, but I wanted to give this person the opportunity to kind of hear out the full... I'm feeling satisfied with it. I don't know who wrote it, but if they have any additional questions, they're welcome to jump in. Otherwise, I wanna give time to more questions. I know, Ray, we were gonna tag team it. Do you have a second question to go? 11:55 Ray: I do. [chuckle]

12:00 Ray: So this is a honeymoon question. So, "As I've recently heard you and other LDS podcasters talk about how newlyweds can have a better honeymoon. Thank you, this conversation is sorely needed. However, I'm disappointed that it so often addresses only the new husband's likely transgressions, while ignoring the new wife's. This makes the conversation feel very one-sided and blaming. I would love to hear you tackle the other half of the problem with equal energy, to round out the conversation by talking just as bluntly to future wives about what they need to know and do, to make their first sexual experience a good one, both for themselves and for their husbands. [noise] Cinderella will wreck a honeymoon just as completely as the inattentive two-minute groom we talked about so often."

12:49 Jennifer: Sorry, you just kind of... I just missed that last sentence. You said, "Cinderella can wreck a honeymoon as quickly as" and then I... I think that's what you said.

12:57 Ray: Yeah, as completely as the inattentive two-minute groom we talk about so often.

13:03 Jennifer: Oh, two-minute groom, got it. Yeah, I mean, probably the reason why I focus on the men is in part because we are so male-focused in our notions of sexuality, and so lots of men come into marriage, and LDS men specifically, in a kind of unacknowledged entitled position. Right?

13:29 Jennifer: So it's kind of like, "I've... This is my prize for having remained virginal all this time, and this is... " And they have learned about sexuality in the frame of, "Women exist to gratify this urge within men." So very often, the couple is complicit in that framing, meaning they come by it honestly, but that's their understanding. And so, it often goes that the woman has a very unsatisfying experience, and they both are kind of participating in this idea that the sexuality is primarily about the man.

14:13 Jennifer: Okay so, "This person wants me to have equal energy." [chuckle] "It's challenging, I don't know if I can generate it or not." [chuckle] But I guess what I would say to a future woman is just everything I say in The Art of Desire course. Right? Which is that your sexuality is as important as the man's sexuality, and this is a partnership. Right? And that if you frame it in this idea that this is a gift you're giving to your future husband, you can say goodbye to positive sexual experiences, because that frame will kill it. 14:54 Jennifer: And so, even though it's the frame you've been taught, and you've also probably been taught the idea that... I'm assuming you all... Yeah, okay, good. I thought I'd lost you, Ray. The idea that your selflessness and your sacrifice is gonna be fundamental to the marriage being happy, and that you are partly responsible for your husband's happiness sexually and in the marriage... That sounds a little bit wrong for me to say it like that, but basically you kind of shoulder this responsibility of him being happy, especially sexually, that that framing is going to make you unhappy in the marriage, it will kill intimacy, and will be a part of you disliking sex soon enough.

15:39 Jennifer: So you must think of it as a shared experience. And I would probably be talking to women about how important it is for them to... If they are relatively naive coming into marriage, how important it is for them to take the time to understand their own capacity for arousal and orgasm, and to not make the focus be intercourse, but mutual arousal, mutual pleasure, and that this is a team sport, and that taking the time to be together in this process, which is... Intercourse and orgasm are not as important as being together in this process of creating something mutual, shared, and desirable by both of you, is extremely important and you ought not move into a passive position, even though you maybe have learned that's the proper way for a woman to be sexually.

16:38 Jennifer: That you are a co-constructor of this relationship, and if you take that position, it's a devaluation of yourself and will interfere with the marriage developing as a partnership. So yeah, I have way more to say on it than that, because I've just... That's kind of like my main passion. But yeah, but that's what I would say is right.

17:08 Ellen: Jennifer, I'd even jump in to say, on your third podcast that we posted, The Virtue, Passion, and Owning your Desire, you spoke a lot to that point of, "Are you ready as a woman to take on being part of the relationship equally?"

17:24 Jennifer: Yeah. Right.

17:25 Ellen: And step into that role. And I thought that was really important to pull out.

17:31 Jennifer: Yeah. Because a lot of people are... [noise]

17:36 Jennifer: Can you hear me alright? Suddenly, it sounded kinda glitchy.

17:37 Ellen: Yeah, I can. Could we make sure everybody's on mute?

17:41 Jennifer: Just got glitchy for a second there.

17:42 Ellen: Yeah, I think... Yeah.

17:44 Jennifer: Yeah, I think so. I think one of the things that we just posted today, a quote from one of the podcasts I did recently, was just that a lot of us are tempted to hide behind a partner. You know? To not really step up and be in an equal position, and a lot of times we talk about that, as the male oppresses the female, but I think what feminism hasn't articulated as clearly as it's talked about that dynamic of oppression is how... Like the upside of being Cinderella in a sense. Do you know that fantasy that someone's gonna caretake you, and protect you from the big bad world, and sort of you can just sort of hide in their shadow.

18:26 Ellen: There's comfort in that.

18:28 Jennifer: Yeah, there's comfort in it for many of us. And we're... So that's why we're complicit in creating an unequal marriage, is we want a caretaker more than we want a partner.

18:36 Ellen: Yeah, so I'd even go to say that there's familiarity in that.

18:40 Jennifer: Oh absolutely. It's... Right, you know? We grew up watching Cinderella.

18:43 Ellen: Exactly.

18:44 Jennifer: You know? [chuckle]

18:46 Jennifer: I mean, I was looking for somebody to ride in on a horse, for sure. You know? [chuckle]

18:50 Ellen: Literally a horse, a white horse.

18:52 Jennifer: Exactly. Exactly. And I remember my first year of marriage and I was actually in a PhD program, I was 29 years old. And my, just my IQ dropped in the first year. I know that sounds ridiculous, but I just started... I had earned all my own money for my mission, for college, I had lived independently for years. Okay? I get married and I start like, I don't know, just doing dumb things, like parking in a tow zone because I thought John had told me it was okay to park there.

19:22 Jennifer: It sounds stupid. I would never have done this in a million years if I had... I was just sort of moving into the frame that I knew, and even my husband was like, "What's going on? Why did you do that?" I'm like, "I don't know, I don't know." [laughter]

19:38 Ellen: I got married. Why is my head so... "

19:42 Jennifer: Exactly. And almost it's like... It's almost in your DNA or something. Like you're just moving into what you've known. And so you have to catch yourself, that you sometimes are dumbing yourself down 'cause you think that's the way you'll keep yourself desirable.

19:56 Ellen: Yeah, I think that's a very good point. It's this idea that that keeps you desirable, but in fact, what keeps you desirable is that ability to make choices and be. And your...

20:07 Jennifer: Yeah. To have an... To have a self in the marriage.

20:10 Ellen: An identity. Yes.

20:11 Jennifer: Absolutely. And any... Any man or woman for that matter, who needs a partner to be under them, for them to feel strong, is a weak person. Right?

20:22 Ellen: Yeah. And you made that point actually in another one of your podcasts recently.

20:25 Jennifer: Yeah and I... I honestly was married to somebody who was like, "Wait, what are you doing? Don't do... " In that meaning he needed me not to do that, he had no need for me to do that. And so it was helping me stay awake to my own kind of blind movement in that direction.

20:43 Ellen: Yeah, and sometimes it just happens, you do it. It's almost this innate... Yes, like you said...

20:50 Jennifer: A hundred percent.

20:50 Ellen: It's an innate reaction and then, someone else finds that, "Oh, okay, we'll do [noise]" It becomes a pattern.

20:57 Jennifer: Absolutely.

20:58 Ellen: But you gotta get yourself out of that pattern.

21:00 Jennifer: Absolutely, and... Yeah, I... I still can do things like that, where if I'm with an intimidating male, I'll go into "Nice girl" instinctively, and just all of a sudden realize I'm throwing all my strength away like an idiot, and so it's just what is easy to do.

21:17 Ellen: Yeah. Yeah. Definitely.

21:19 Ray: And perhaps that's actually another thing we don't do very well in preparing people to be married, is you've lived your whole life as an individual, and now you've gotta learn how to be in a relationship all the time with somebody. And if you've been on your own a long time, you're probably actually looking forward to being able to lean on a partner to help with... You know.

21:40 Jennifer: Yeah. Yeah. But "Lean on" might be a little different than the experience of partnering and sharing the burden, where "Lean on" is a little more of a dependency model, but the collaboration model is really where you have intimate partnerships. That, "How can I bring my strengths, and you bring your strengths to bear, and we can create something stronger and better together." But it's not dependency, in the kind of up-down way. Mm-hmm.

22:08 Ray: Yeah. And that was... That was not what I was implying, by the way, but yeah...

22:11 Jennifer: Yeah. Sure, sure. Yeah. I'm just a word Nazi, I have to say... [laughter] Because... Because words communicate meaning, so I'm like, "No, wrong meaning." But anyway. [chuckle]

22:20 Daniel: So maybe a slightly different perspective, I've worked with a lot of men who've been very patient, they've stopped the pursuing of sex, or taking that dominant role, and have allowed themselves, from maybe your podcasts or things that they've just learned naturally, to kinda back off and allow that space to be there. But then, something else that's happened is kind of what we're talking about, is [cough] Excuse me. I just choked.

22:51 Daniel: Is, the female has no desire to pursue desire. So months go by, six months will go by. In some cases, even years will go by

23:02 Ray: Or decades.

23:03 Daniel: where the husband is not bringing it up in a... Maybe occasionally, "Is it a good time tonight?" But then, the partner's just like, "No, I'm fine." Right? How... I realize that's a huge topic but, how would you go about addressing that? And what's the role... What does... Does the man just not pursue it anymore or what?

23:24 Jennifer: No, no. Definitely not. And I hope I can address this well 'cause I'm... I am, 100% I promise going to do a class on men's sexuality this year. [chuckle]

23:37 Daniel: Great.

23:37 Jennifer: Yeah, I keep promising this, but I actually am gonna do it so... [chuckle] Anyway. But I do hope I can talk quite a bit about this, because I think we've sort of socialized men either into the entitled position, or they... If they don't wanna be that, then they almost can't own desire at all. They see it as, "It's offensive that I want it." And, "This is just this hedonistic, bad part of me." And they can sometimes be partnered with a wife who kinda takes the moral high ground of not wanting sex, or whatever. And this, of course, gets very punctuated by... If porn has been in the picture at all, because you know, now you can kinda claim that you're the bad one because you want sex, and it can make it really hard to deal with the sexless-ness of the marriage.

24:22 Jennifer: So what I would be thinking about is, if you're the higher-desire person, whether male or female, and your spouse does not desire you, I think the first question I would want to deal with is, "Why?" Okay? Why don't they desire me? Is it about me? Or is it about them? Or both? Is it that I'm not desirable? And that I'm functioning in a way in my life, or in the marriage, or in the sexual relationship, that it is actually good judgment that they don't desire me?

24:53 Jennifer: And/or is there something going on in them that they don't want to deal with, or grow up, or handle around sexuality? And that's obviously it seems like a basic question, but it's one that people surprisingly don't ask themselves very much. Because as I was talking to somebody a couple of nights ago, I was saying, "Why not go ahead and just ask your wife why she doesn't desire you?" And the reason for him is he doesn't want to hear the answer.

25:23 Ellen: I was gonna say, that's a very scary question to ask.

25:26 Jennifer: Yes, exactly. And in part because he already knows the answer, and he doesn't wanna deal with his own neediness, and the ways that he takes advantage in the marriage, and the things that are actually there that he would need to deal with to be freely desired. I mean, that's the bummer about marriage and intimacy, is that your partner gets to know you. And so, the things that... Your limitations become anti-aphrodisiacs often.

26:02 Jennifer: And so if you're gonna really grow in a marriage and a partnership, you have to really look at, "How do I engage or deal in a way that makes me undesirable?" Sometimes people are undesirable, and I'll just speak in the stereotypical way for a moment about, you know, some men are undesirable because they're too apologetic about their sexuality.

26:20 Jennifer: Because they sort of devalue it also. And they want their wife to manage the question of their desirability. Or manage the question of the legitimacy of their sexuality. And so, when they are too anxious, or apologetic, or looking for reinforcement around their sexuality, it feels more like mothering or caretaking on the part of their spouse, and that's very undesirable. And so, it's a hard question for men, and for all of us, I think in some ways, of, "How do I stand up for something I want, without being a bully?" Right? "And be contained enough without being wimpy and apologetic for my sexuality?"

27:10 Jennifer: "And how do I find that middle ground of kind of owning that my sexuality is legitimate and being clear about my desirability?" Without somehow taking advantage or being too reticent around it. And I think the answer, it's not an easy one to give in just a podcast really, because you kind of have to work with people around what's actually going on. But I think you have to really look honestly and with a clear eye towards the issue of your desirability.

27:47 Jennifer: And your own comfort with your sexuality and your sexual desires. Because if you can be clear that you are choosable, and clear that what you want is a good thing, and doesn't harm your spouse or you, then you can stand up for it and deal with... Because it could be that your spouse doesn't want sex because she or he just doesn't wanna deal with their anxieties about sex. And maybe you've been pressured in the marriage to coddle those anxieties too much and too long. And it's creating resentment and low growth. Well then it would actually be a desirable position, even though a challenging one, to stand up more for the sexual relationship moving forward, like in that one podcast I did. 28:36 Ray: Okay. Alright.

28:36 Jennifer: So are there other follow-up questions about that, or thoughts? If anybody has them, I'm happy to...

28:44 Ray: I'm guessing here, but the person who asked the question, 'cause I've heard you talk about it, I've heard, I think, Natasha Helfer-Parker talk about it, Nate Bagley talk about it. And it does kinda sound pretty one-sided, it's, "Husband, you gotta set your agenda aside, you have to make it all about her. Don't be a jerk."

29:12 Jennifer: Yeah.

29:13 Ray: My experience was... And I know a lot of other men have, we've had a similar experience, is it's not that we wanted, it was, we weren't gonna just run over our wife and get what we wanted. 29:24 Jennifer: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

29:25 Ray: You know? And we wanted to know we...

29:26 Jennifer: You maybe didn't have... You didn't have a participant maybe from the get-go, some people. Yes, definitely.

29:32 Ray: And so, if your partner shows up without any clue at all about what they want or what they need...

29:40 Jennifer: Sure. Oh, yeah.

29:41 Ray: How do you navigate that?

29:42 Jennifer: That's... Absolutely, that's... Right, it can't be collaborative if one person isn't... Not showing up, if they're pulling for a passive position. And many people are and you know, women have been taught not to kinda claim their sexuality because it's anti-feminine. You know? And so a lot of people believe they're gonna show up and the man is gonna teach them about their sexuality, and really, How does he know? [chuckle] I mean, right? For the very people.

30:13 Ray: Exactly.

30:14 Jennifer: And also, how do you co-create something, unless you're both participants in this process? So yeah, it's true. Yeah.

30:23 Leann: I think the frustrating thing is that, and I was one of them, oftentimes women don't, they don't realize they have desire, and they don't even feel like there's anything for... They're not the one with the problem, it's the husband wanting it and I guess pressuring. But when I'm in this intimacy group and it breaks my heart to hear from the husbands, 'cause the wives aren't in the group, they have no desire to want to get better, as far as the sexual relationship.

30:56 Leann: So that's what breaks my heart, is these husbands want to, but the wives just shut it down. They don't wanna have anything to do with helping themselves, or how... You know? And that's what I get frustrated in, is how do you help these husbands stand up for what... It would be beautiful, and right, and good in this relationship, but the wives just want nothing to do with it.

31:21 Jennifer: Yeah, yeah, and I mean, there's... Well, there's the part of me that's compassionate towards the wives, and then the part that would challenge the wives. Okay? So the compassionate part is, "This is how it's all set up." Okay? So desire is bad, sexual desire, any kind of desire. I grew up, the whole Young Women's Manual is about your selflessness, and how that makes you desirable, and that's the frame. Right? So it is a passive frame.

31:50 Jennifer: And that sexuality is a challenge to your desirability. So you wanna shut it down. I have lots of clients who had sexual feelings and thoughts, they'd watch Love Boat and masturbate, and [chuckle] so on and on. And then, they'd feel so guilty and bad, that they'd repent and shut it down and shut it down. You know?

32:10 Leann: Yes.

32:11 Jennifer: And like, as an act of righteousness and sacrifice would basically shut this whole thing down. Then they show up on their wedding night, and they're supposed to be a participant? I mean, based on what? So, meaning we culturally create this. Now, that said, because I have compassion for that, both... And men too, because for the men that maybe are too eager or whatever, they've also... They come by it honestly, they've been sort of taught this idea that women's sexuality exists for their benefit, and for their delight, and so on. So people come by it honestly.

32:45 Jennifer: I think, where I would be challenging of women is when they just don't want... You know, I talk about hiding in the shadow. A lot of us don't wanna own what our desires are, or cultivate them, or figure them out. Because we don't want the exposure of it. We want the safety of having somebody else caretake us. We want the belief, or the fantasy that this makes us more righteous, or more noble, or whatever. And we wanna sell that idea, because what we really know is, we don't wanna sort of grow up and take an adult position sexually.

33:16 Jennifer: And so, I think, the challenge is once you start... I had a lot of women whose husbands signed them up for the workshop or something, and they are mad, because... And legitimately so, because they feel like, "Look, you just want me to go get fixed, so that you will get everything that you want." Well then, sometimes they show up there, and then they realize, "No, that's not the approach she's taking. And I have this whole aspect of myself, that I have shut down, that it's felt so self-betraying."

33:47 Jennifer: And then, they suddenly realize, "Wait, I want to develop this part of me, I want to be whole again, I don't want to always be living in reference to my husband's sexuality." So they really just start to grow into it, and they start to figure out, and sort of deprogram these parts of themselves. There was other people that don't want to develop this part of themselves, because they are afraid... They're in a marriage where they're afraid, if they start to develop any of it, it will just get hijacked and used for the benefit of the husband, because the dynamic of the marriage has to be addressed, still.

34:19 Jennifer: But then, there's other people who just, like I said, don't really wanna grow up and develop. And they can hold the other... Their spouse hostage. And they can get the moral high ground, because he's looked at porn, or whatever it is. And it's cruel. You know? [chuckle] It is absolutely cruel. And people can definitely do that, because they just don't want to grow up, don't want to be fair, don't want to take on the full responsibility of sharing a life with somebody. A lot of us get married with the idea that, "You're gonna manage my sense of self and make me happy."

34:54 Jennifer: Men and women do this. Very few of us, if we really thought about what we are committing to, would even get married. Because what we're really committing to is, "I'm willing to basically deal with my limitations, and grow myself up for your benefit, given that you're willing to actually hook yourself to me. And I'm willing to really be a good friend to you, and do all the growth that that's gonna require of me." I mean, that's what you ultimately agree to, if you're gonna be happily married.

35:22 Ellen: So you're speaking a lot of collaboration. A collaboration alliance.

35:25 Jennifer: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

35:28 Ellen: Now, I understand you've spoken in the past of collaboration alliance versus collusive alliance?

35:33 Jennifer: Yeah, a collaborative alliance versus a collusive one, yes.

35:36 Ellen: What's your difference in that? It being a unilateral? Can you speak a little bit more of that?

35:41 Jennifer: Well, a collaborative alliance is, I think, the easiest way to say it. And I'm sure if David Schnarch were here, he would say it much more thoroughly. But basically, the idea that David Schnarch is talking about, is that a collaborative alliance is you are willing to do your part in a partnership towards a shared aim. Being good parents, be creating a good marriage in which two people thrive, creating a good sexual relationship in which two people thrive, that would be collaborative. And you do your part, whether or not your spouse is doing their part. You don't use the fact that your spouse may be having a bad day, and not doing their part, to get yourself off the hook around your part.

36:18 Ellen: Definitely.

36:19 Jennifer: That you're willing to stand up, and be a grown-up, and deal with things, even if your spouse is having a bad day. A collusive alliance is basically, where the worst in your spouse, and your worst in you... And everybody's in some version of a collusive alliance with their spouse. The happier people have less of one. Okay? [chuckle]

36:37 Jennifer: But a collusive alliance is the worst in you, hooks into the worst in me, and it justifies the worst in each of us. We use the worst in each other to justify the worst in ourselves. So it's like, you know people say to me all the time in therapy, "I wouldn't be such a jerk if he weren't such a... What a... " You know, like meaning... This is collusive alliance, that I don't have to deal with my sexuality because you're a jerk.

37:03 Jennifer: And so I use the fact that you're a jerk to keep justifying that I don't deal with my sexuality. But you can get really mean, and hostile, and nasty, 'cause you know I won't develop this part of myself. Right? So that's the way it dips... Reinforces. And I'm constantly in therapy being like, "Stop dealing with your spouse, deal with yourself. It's the only way this will move forward." I'm always saying that. 37:23 Ellen: Look in the mirror. [chuckle]

37:25 Jennifer: Exactly, get the beam out of your own eye. [laughter]

37:28 Daniel: Ellen or Ray, there is, I think, a few questions or comments in the comments section. So you don't have to do it at this moment, but when you have a second, follow up with that. 37:36 Ray: We'll have a look at that, thanks.

37:38 Ellen: Yeah.

37:40 Ray: When you've got a script for how to have that conversation with your kids…[noise] 37:48 Ellen: Ray, I think you're cutting out.

37:49 Jennifer: Yeah. Yeah, you just cut out there Ray. Can you say it again? How to get your kids to do that?

37:54 Ray: Yeah, I wanna know, if you ever have a script for how to address that with your kids. 'Cause that's the, kind of the bell. Right?

37:58 Jennifer: Well, when there are kids who are younger, what... 38:00 Ray: "'Cause you started it." "Well, you started it."

38:01 Jennifer: Well yeah, yeah, when my kids were younger, and this was a borrow, I think, from the IRIS book. But basically, they would have to sit on the couch, and they couldn't get off until they each owned what their role was in the problem. So...

38:12 Ray: Yes.

38:13 Jennifer: Yeah, that's one version of it, yeah. Another version is, like, put you both in the same boat, and until you can come up with the solution, neither one gets the positive thing. So you have to collaborate to get the positive thing. Right.

38:28 Ray: Right. Okay.

38:30 Ellen: So kind of back to a topic that we had been discussing about the woman really stepping into the role of being collaborative, and in equal partnership in the relationship. We have a comment in the chat box saying, "How do we change the church culture problems of the unclear functioning of women?" I've... So Nicole feel free... Oh.

38:54 Jennifer: Can you say that again? Say that to me...

38:55 Ellen: Nicole, feel free to jump in and clarify that. I don't know if I read it... "So how do we change that church culture problem of the unclear functioning women? Woman."

39:05 Nicole: Under-functioning.

39:05 Jennifer: Meaning that... Oh, under-functioning.

39:06 Ray: Under-functioning.

39:06 Jennifer: There, under-functioning.

39:07 Ellen: Oh, under-functioning...

39:07 Jennifer: Yeah, there we go.

39:08 Ellen: That is why. [chuckle]

39:09 Jennifer: Yeah, good.

39:10 Jennifer: So how do we change that culture? I mean, it's the women themselves often that are doing the teaching. To basically teach better and teach differently. I mean that like, you know, we can't necessarily go in and change or control what is in the curriculum, but we can change how we each talk to women and we can change what we share in Relief Society and so on, what we... So that's about the best we have. You can do podcasts. [chuckle]

39:41 Ellen: You can say really, it's really us, we can...

39:44 Jennifer: It's us.

39:45 Ellen: Change us, and us will change our relationships with others, and our others or relationships with others will change the others we interact with, and it will expand.

39:54 Jennifer: Yeah, absolutely, and I just tend... A lot of times we think the church is the leadership, and then...

40:00 Ellen: It comes down to that too, yeah.

40:00 Jennifer: We are the church. You have to think of it that way, in my opinion, and you just roll up your sleeves and have as much impact as you can, because I think the more you role model strength like that, the more you give people permission to relate to themselves, or to women in general, differently.

40:26 Ellen: So I'm ready to move on to another question that was posed. Ray, do you have any follow-up to the question that you had?

40:34 Ray: Nope.

40:34 Ellen: No? Alright. So the next one is a really interesting one, it says, "How is it best to navigate having sex during marriage struggles?" They go on to say, "When she's rude, or attacks the kids, or criticizes, or makes fun of me in front of the kids, I'm so repulsed, I don't feel like being around her at all. But then, eventually, within a few days or less, we both get the biological urge and want to enjoy each other, so we do."

41:01 Ellen: "And it's great, and we feel closer and better afterwards, but I worry she thinks everything is okay or resolved because we're having sex. When it's not. Perhaps that's how she feels as well. We are starting therapy... " Or, "We started therapy a few months ago, and that's helpful, though expensive. A chance to talk through things. However, in general, when we get a rare chance to be alone and talk away from the kids, we'd mostly rather have sex than talk about our problems."

41:26 Jennifer: Okay, well, that's the problem.

41:27 Ellen: "Is that a good approach?" [chuckle]

41:27 Jennifer: Wrong, no.

41:29 Ellen: "Give me advice in that respect, what we do when our problems are all so present?"

41:34 Jennifer: Well, it doesn't have to be one or the other, because you could say, "I really wanna have sex with you, but I think the way you talked to the kids today was horrible." Okay? And you don't have to necessarily put them right next to each other. But I wouldn't say one precludes the other necessarily. You can say, "I like you, you matter to me. I like having sex with you and I'm really concerned about how we're parenting the kids, and specifically how you are harsh with them, and then I come in and I coddle them." Or whatever it is. I don't think it has to... I think what maybe the person's asking is, "If I address this, it may very well kill... "

42:10 Ellen: I would say, absolutely yes.

42:11 Jennifer: "Our ability to have sex." Right? But then, I would say, if that's really true, if you can't deal with your problems and have sex at the same time, then you probably shouldn't be having sex. Because if dealing honestly with what's going on in the marriage means that you're gonna go through a period of time in which desire gets challenged, well I personally think you have a deeper responsibility to the well-being of the marriage, and your role as parents, than to whether or not you have the... How to say it? The placating experience of having sex. So I'm not here to say that necessarily you'll get one or the other, but if you know that you get one or the other, then I think you have to be really careful about how you're relating to sex, 'cause it has its costs.

43:05 Ellen: So if we go back to the original... Oh, go ahead.

43:06 Jennifer: Okay. No, I was just saying it has its cost if you keep kicking... You know, I talk in my marriage course about over-reactors, people that are freaking out all the time. But then there's also people that are under-reactors or they don't deal with problems as they arise. That's as toxic to a marriage. You then have people that look like they're doing great, because they have sex or they are low-conflict, but a huge storm is brewing, and oftentimes when those marriages rupture, they rupture permanently. Because they have no ability to... They have no ability to kinda handle the problems, because they have no practice in it. And so, under-reacting to your troubles, is really setting yourself up.

43:51 Ellen: Yeah, it's an avoidance technique.

43:53 Jennifer: Yeah.

43:54 Ellen: That's basically what they're doing.

43:55 Jennifer: And you know, of course the problems grow. They don't go away, they grow, they start getting out of your control when you don't deal with them.

44:03 Ellen: And they're certainly recognizing that, like they've said that they don't like that they're doing this, that they're concerned about this, they've started going to therapy, they recognize that's a very expensive way [chuckle] to talk. And... But they are...

44:21 Jennifer: Good luck if you're gonna go into... [chuckle]

44:23 Ellen: But they also recognize that they're physically attracted, and they have, as they say, the biological urge, and they want to pursue that as well. And so I see that as a good thing, as well, that they still have that, despite this... [overlapping conversation]

44:38 Jennifer: Yeah, well, and it doesn't mean that you can't have sex for sure, 'cause there's lots of couples that are dealing with their troubles, and they're still having sex.

44:45 Ellen: Yeah.

44:46 Jennifer: It's just another way of being together and sort of, you know, I think sometimes we have the idea that everything must be good in the relationship, and then sex is legitimized. It's just kind of a Mormon cultural idea we have. I don't see it that way, because I think a good sexual relationship can give you some of the sustenance to kinda keep dealing with the challenges. Part of why I've worked out things with my husband is 'cause I'm attracted to him. [chuckle] Okay?

45:12 Jennifer: And I want a good sexual relationship, but I want, you know... And so, that desire pushes you through the troubles. It gives you the energy to deal with the hard things. So I wouldn't necessarily say it should... You shouldn't be having sex, I would say if you're using it to get away from your troubles, then it's a problem.

45:32 Ellen: But using it for motivation to work through this?

45:35 Jennifer: Sure, absolutely. Now, I think what some people are afraid of is if they talk about hard things, then their spouse won't wanna have sex with them. So it's a kind of a kind of... People can be complicit in not dealing with things, the sad issue. But you certainly can use it as a resource, 100%.

45:54 Ellen: So their general question is, "How best to navigate having sex during marriage struggles?" It sounds like you're saying, of course don't cut it out, [chuckle] altogether.

46:04 Jennifer: Yeah.

46:05 Ellen: So... But don't use it as a way to avoid having those conversations.

46:09 Jennifer: Exactly. Exactly.

46:10 Ellen: Because there may be some fear around having those conversations, that it will reduce the amount of sex that you're having, but using the desire for each other as a motivation to work through those troubles, because you wanna get close together. Is that right?

46:26 Jennifer: Yes. Yeah, and I would say what often happens for couples is when they're right in the heat of the struggle, sometimes their desire goes down, but as they start to work things out, the sex gets way better. You know? It's like that, you feel gratitude, you see your partner as somebody who's willing to deal with things, you feel more aware of your separateness as a couple and through some of the struggle, and so the sex is more positive. So I wouldn't see it as one or the other, but I think if you want good sex, you want your relationship to keep growing and thriving, and that means dealing with hard things.

47:01 Ellen: Yeah, I can imagine that coming through difficulties and then coming to this place of convergence, where you're just together on something and you've almost... You've repaired something together.

47:15 Jennifer: Absolutely.

47:15 Ellen: It would make it even more powerful and even more meaningful.

47:19 Jennifer: Absolutely. Absolutely. So yeah, I think that's how couples continue to create novelty. In a long-term partnership there's only so much novelty you can generate. And I'm all for novelty, but it's still the same person, it's [chuckle] the same room, or whatever. 47:38 Ellen: That's so true. [laughter]

47:41 Jennifer: So you know, but I mean...

47:42 Ellen: I worry about that.

47:44 Jennifer: Yeah, sure. And I'm all for novelty. There's a lot of fun things you can do to create novelty, but I think what's at the core of a good intimate marriage is a growing marriage. It's a marriage that's growing, and you don't take the other person for granted. You recognize that they will challenge things in themselves, they'll deal with things honestly, you keep sort of becoming aware over and over again, that this is a separate person from you, who owes you nothing, but that will continue to grow and do better for your benefit and their own benefit, and that drives respect and desire. And so...

48:17 Ellen: I think that is a really key point, that I'll personally draw out, is they owe you nothing.

48:25 Jennifer: That's right.

48:25 Ellen: That's hard to swallow.

48:26 Jennifer: Yeah, I know.

48:27 Ellen: Because there's this sense of, "I've done this for you, you do this for me." Give-take. "You owe me" kind of idea...

48:36 Jennifer: Exactly.

48:36 Ellen: But to get away from that...

48:37 Jennifer: Yes.

48:38 Ellen: Feeling. That's hard. [laughter]

48:41 Jennifer: It's hard and it's the only way to do marriage, in my opinion.

48:44 Ellen: That's novel. [chuckle]

48:45 Jennifer: To do it from a passionate position, because as soon as you get it into, "I need this, you're obligated, you owe me." Right?

48:52 Ellen: Or even just the marriage contract idea of, "We... You married me, for good and for bad. This is bad, you are in it with me." This idea of, "You owe this for me, we're working on this." Making sure that you're not using that as a form of manipulation.

49:08 Jennifer: Yes.

49:09 Ellen: But a motivation to work together.

49:12 Jennifer: Yeah, which is not about precluding you from running your life, because you can say, "Look, here are the terms of my participation in this marriage, and if you don't wanna live by those terms, I can choose to exit." Okay? I know that's hard when you have a mortgage and kids, and all that, but you can define the terms of your participation, you can control your own choices. But I think as soon as we are in the idea that, "You owe me."

49:39 Jennifer: As a way to pressure and to... As a way to be in a marriage, you will kill desire. When it's more like, "Wow, this person chooses me day, after day, after day. That's amazing. This person has offered goodness to my life, and they don't have to. And they do. And that they do, it's a miracle actually." When you live in that frame, which is the only honest way to live in the world, to be honest. Who's owed anything? There's children starving in Africa, do you think that's what... They're getting what they deserve? You know what I mean?

50:13 Jennifer: No, but when you get good things it's good fortune. It's by grace, it's by... And so if you don't live in a gratitude-based frame, you're gonna have a hard time living with joy. And you have to live it, I think you have to live in that frame in marriage. Now again, I know people get like, "Wait a minute. Well, do you just mean you have to take whatever you get? The person's having affairs, you can't... "

50:34 Jennifer: No, I'm not saying you can't decide if somebody is bringing too little good, if somebody is trying to take advantage of that commitment you've made. That you may then have to make other choices, because living with them is not good for you. Right? Continuing to struggle with them is not good for you. But the idea that... But that's different than living in marriage from a frame of demand. And a lot of people want the safety of doing that.

51:04 Ellen: And I think there's this importance of, again as you've mentioned, this independence of self. You've mentioned in your other podcasts sometimes you do have to bring the conversation to the point of, "I'm willing to step away from this marriage."

51:19 Jennifer: Absolutely.

51:19 Ellen: If that's the case, "Because this is not good for either of us." And that's a very scary place to come to.

51:25 Jennifer: Oh yeah. But it's usually where people grow the most. It's when they realize, "I can't make this marriage happen." That for me is when people often make their biggest strides in their development, is when they stop trying to control whether or not their proud spouse chooses them, whether or not the marriage stays together. They're no longer controlling that, they're only controlling who they are, in the marriage.

51:48 Jennifer: When people really take that developmental step, that's when marriages really... Well, sometimes they fall apart at that point, because the other person won't step up. Or they really, really take a massive step forward. Because people are really operating, not from trying to obligate and control, but really a framing of choosing, and controlling themselves, and who they are in the marriage.

52:09 Ellen: Maybe I'm making a leap here but, Would you say that that's more a high-desire partner position to be in than a low-desire? To kind of...

52:19 Jennifer: To put the question of the marriage on the line, you're saying?

52:22 Ellen: Yeah, yeah.

52:25 Jennifer: Well, it depends on, "Why?"

52:25 Ellen: I don't know...

52:25 Jennifer: It would depend on "Why?" If somebody is in a marriage where their spouse just won't develop or deal with their sexuality, yes.

52:32 Ellen: That's where I'm... Yeah, that's where I'm looking. Right.

52:34 Jennifer: If somebody is in a low-desire position because their spouse is narcissistic, for example, or won't deal with the ways that they take too much in the marriage, and they keep trying to stand up to get that person to deal with who they are, because they do want a good sexual relationship, they just don't want sex in the current form. Okay? They're low-desire because of good judgment. Well, then they may be the one who's saying, "Look, I want good sex too, I just don't want what you're offering. It's all about you." And so, they may be the ones putting on... You know, calling it quits.

53:08 Ellen: Interesting.

53:10 Ray: I think, whenever the notion of, "Is sex a good enough reason to leave the marriage" comes up, there are a lot of people who are really quick to jump on that because they're afraid that if we normalize that, that's gonna be everybody's first choice. "I don't get what I want, I'm out."

53:29 Jennifer: Yeah, yeah.

53:30 Ray: And in my experience, it's really the opposite. It's when you're willing to actually walk away from... It takes a lot to be willing to walk away from what you have.

53:40 Jennifer: Absolutely.

53:40 Ray: I don't know that it's... That's anybody's first choice.

53:44 Jennifer: Well, and I think a lot of the time when people are saying, "Is sex enough reason?" We have it in the hedonistic frame, rather than if sex really isn't happening in a marriage, there's something bad going on. [chuckle] Okay? You know what I mean? Like, I mean...

53:58 Daniel: Yeah, it's not the sex. [chuckle]

54:00 Jennifer: Yeah, it's not the sex. Exactly, it's not the sex.

54:02 Daniel: Sorry, I don't mean to laugh, but...

54:04 Jennifer: No, but then you're right. The sex is an indicator of something much more profoundly important going on. And so, the sex is the canary in the coal mine.

54:14 Ellen: And I think that actually hits the point of the original question, the debate around sex not being neediness, or isn't sexy, but also wanting to talk about the importance of it.

54:25 Jennifer: Yeah.

54:27 Ellen: I think it goes back to that. I know that you've said it's not necessarily about the sex, but... It's the canary but, What killed the canary? [chuckle]

54:35 Jennifer: You know, exactly. It's exactly right. Why is the canary dead? Okay? Can we look at that? [laughter]

54:44 Jennifer: Exactly. Is there just too much noxious gas that the canary can't breathe? Or is the canary faking dead so that it doesn't have to, you know... [overlapping conversation]

54:54 Ellen: It's looking away. [laughter]

54:58 Jennifer: Yeah.

54:58 Ellen: Well, it is about three minutes to the hour, so I wanna respect your time. It has been a pleasure chatting with you, and being able to listen more. Our focus to three podcasts and collect people's questions and really just discuss with you. So I wanted to give you a couple minutes to close up, any closing thoughts you had as far as the discussions that we've had today. If there's any kind of ending thoughts you'd like to share, and then give you that au revoir and [chuckle] the opportunity to sign off, and...

55:38 Jennifer: Sure.

55:38 Ellen: Really one day invite you to come back, we'd love to have a follow-up at some point, and do this again.

55:45 Jennifer: Sure.

55:46 Ellen: But the time is yours.

55:48 Jennifer: I'm trying to think if I have any profound final thoughts. [laughter]

55:53 Ellen: You're probably thinking a lot actually. [chuckle]

55:57 Jennifer: Well, I guess maybe I would just say I respect in everybody that's here, the pursuit of sorting through these hard things, like marriage and intimate relationships are not easy. To achieve the beauty that relationships are capable of, takes a lot of courage. Courage to deal honestly with ourselves, to deal honestly with our spouse, to face hard things. Happy marriages are not for sissies. Okay?

56:30 Ray: Soundbite. [laughter]

56:39 Jennifer: So I really do...

56:41 Daniel: Jennifer?

56:41 Jennifer: Yeah, go ahead.

56:42 Daniel: My wife just wanted... Heard what you said and wants to put it on a t-shirt. Do we need to get a waiver or something? "Happy marriages aren't for sissies." [chuckle]

56:50 Jennifer: Aren't for sissies. Yeah, you could do that, just stick my name on it and my website... [laughter]

56:55 Daniel: You got it.

57:00 Jennifer: So yeah. So I respect it, I always respect it because I think it's the best in humans when people are willing to kind of face those hard things. And when I watch people go through it, it's hard. But it's really where all the beauty lies. So, there's divinity in all that process, even though it can feel like you're in hell sometimes.

57:25 Ellen: Well said.

57:25 Jennifer: Okay.

57:28 Ellen: Well, Jennifer thank you so much for your time.

57:31 Jennifer: You're welcome.

57:32 Ellen: Have a wonderful evening, and keep warm out there. [chuckle]

57:36 Jennifer: Thank you, I'll try.

57:37 Ellen: Please try to stay warm.

57:39 Jennifer: Okay, thanks everybody. Bye.

57:40 Ray: Thank you.

57:41 Ellen: Bye-bye. So, we're on. Yeah, go ahead Ray. You got it.

57:46 Ray: No.

57:46 Ellen: Well you got the book. [chuckle]

57:49 Ray: Okay. Let's go ahead and stop the recording at that point.

Mental and Spiritual Health Challenge for General Conference

Twice a year we have the wonderful privilege of hearing from our leaders to receive spiritual guidance and counsel at the General Conference of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Each year the messages of these amazing men and women seem to have a greater impact on my life. Maybe you're like me and sometimes feel they prepared their message specifically for you. Conference is a spiritual feast that nourishes your soul when so many other responsibilities and life tax your soul.

However, if you are like me and many others, conference can also be anxiety-provoking and overwhelming. There are times a leader’s message doesn't seem to align with scriptural or spiritual guidance received in the course of seeking answers to prayers. Other times, the feelings of anxiety become overwhelming as you have spent the last weeks, months and even years doing all you can to be met with a message of "do more." Sometimes a speaker doesn't seem to understand the complexities of life with their overly simplified solutions, which then elicits the guilty, self-reflective, self-punishing idea that maybe you don't have enough faith.

Elder Holland warned about this risk;

"My brothers and sisters, except for Jesus, there have been no flawless performances on this earthly journey we are pursuing, so while in mortality let’s strive for steady improvement without obsessing over what behavioral scientists call “toxic perfectionism.” We should avoid that latter excessive expectation of ourselves and of others and, I might add, of those who are called to serve in the Church—which for Latter-day Saints means everyone, for we are all called to serve somewhere." —Be Ye Therefore Perfect—Eventually

Although I think most don't believe our leaders are infallible, this is this cultural assumption—that ALL things spoken in conference are "right", "true", "doctrine", or "scripture" and are meant as an infallible guide for your personal life. Unfortunately, this cultural belief feeds the toxic perfectionism spoken of by Elder Holland. Therefore, this conference I encourage you to get the most out of every message by taking the “Mental and Spiritual Health Challenge for General Conference.” Here it is:

1. Verbally remind yourself that God is working through imperfect people with their perceptions, bias, family culture and predispositions.

2. Verbally remind yourself that not everything—in fact, most things—spoken in conference are NOT doctrine, but rather personal experiences of imperfect people making sense of an infinite and eternal gospel.

Edited (10/5/19 12:30 pm) to include the following quotes from Elder Oaks Conference address October 5th, Saturday morning session:

At the same time it should be remembered that not every statement made by a Church leader, past or present, necessarily constitutes doctrine. It is commonly understood in the Church that a statement made by one leader on a single occasion often represents a personal, though well-considered, opinion, not meant to be official or binding for the whole Church. -Elder Todd Christofferson, "The Doctrine of Christ," April 2012 General Conference, Sunday Morning Session (1 Apr 2012)

There is an important principle that governs the doctrine of the Church. The doctrine is taught by all 15 members of the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve. It is not hidden in an obscure paragraph of one talk. True principles are taught frequently and by many. Our doctrine is not difficult to find. The leaders of the Church are honest but imperfect men. Remember the words of Moroni: “Condemn me not because of mine imperfection, neither my father … ; but rather give thanks unto God that he hath made manifest unto you our imperfections, that ye may learn to be more wise than we have been.” (Mormon 9:31) Neil L. Anderson, "Trial of Your Faith," Ensign (Nov 2012)

3. Verbally remind yourself to conscientiously check in with your Father in Heaven if the message is meant for you and is something you should prioritize in your life.

4. Verbally acknowledge that even leaders say things that are confusing, unclear and even wrong. Trust your ongoing relationship with God and allow clarity to come from HIM.

5. Verbally acknowledge that if you come away from conference with the idea that you need to do more, be better, work harder, read more scriptures, and/or sacrifice more—it’s most likely the influence of toxic perfectionism and not the spirit of Christ. See Elder Hollands talk cautioning against “toxic perfectionism” here: “Be Ye Therefore Perfect — Eventually”

6. Verbally promise yourself that you will not assume a speaker’s words are more important or correct than your relationship and revelation from God.

7. Verbally acknowledge that emotions are NOT the same as spiritual confirmation or revelation.

8. Verbally remind yourself to be present, feeling and thinking about your own experience during conference.

The gospel is joyous. We should be rejoicing and feeling God’s love and learning how to emulate that love. His love is healing, not hurtful or depressing.

The Unintelligent Parent

The following is an excerpt from Relief Society Magazine: Guide Lessons For April 1927 Lesson IV Social Service (Fourth Week in April).

Emotional Problems of Childhood—Jane and Henrietta 

Serious and difficult emotional problems are presented by the two adolescent girls, Jane and Henrietta. Both were the victims of unintelligent parents. The basis of these problems is not uncommon in adolescent development because of lack of understanding by their parents; one girl was on the verge of a mental breakdown, and the other was contemplating suicide. Both suffered these serious emotional upsets because of the lack of sex education and guidance.

It will be remembered from the introductory discussion of emotional problems that the individual has three dominant instincts or urges—the ego, or self; the herd, or social; and the sex or love instinct. The three instincts all seek expression, and if thwarted or frustrated cause emotional disturbances the individual expresses his ego urge by accomplishing certain ends and experiencing the joy and satisfaction of expression. He satisfies his social urge by gaining the confidence and approval of his family, playmates, and friends. In the studies of the emotional problems of childhood, it has been pointed out that the failure to gain normal expression or the failure to gain approval seriously affects the development of the child. His defeats, and unhappiness, and sense of failure deeply affect his emotional life, limiting his development, and making his conduct abnormal.

In our home and school life the tendency has been to ignore inquiry into the other important instinct, sex. The subject has been a taboo. Because sex has been recognized as a compelling life force, but its aspects have not been generally understood, the whole subject has taken on an atmosphere of morbid secrecy.

Sex education is the responsibility of the home. The first questions of the origin and development of life are asked in the home. The relation between parents, the relation between parents and their children, the attitude of brothers and sisters toward one another, and toward their friends, are all phases of sex relationships, and depend on wholesome; home guidance to lead the child to normal, healthful attitudes.

The method of sex education will not be the subject of this discussion, for the subject itself deserves special attention and study. The purpose of studying the problems of Jane and Henrietta is to observe the real dangers and pitfalls that endanger adolescents if, through lack of home guidance, they have wrong information concerning sex, and unwholesome attitudes because of their misconceptions.

Jane at nineteen was at the beginning of a mental breakdown she was suffering from what is known as an anxiety neurosis. This condition was the result of a secret worry that she had tried to crowd out of her conscious life. In spite of her effort to forget her worry, the unconscious mind kept harboring and remembering until she came near a breakdown All her anxiety, and nervousness, and weeping, and unhappiness, were the result of wrong sex information given her by her mother. She had at twelve, and again at sixteen met an experience not at all uncommon in childhood. Her mother had observed that she masturbated—practiced self-abuse—and had used the unintelligent method of correcting her by telling the child that she would go crazy if she did not stop the practice.

The mother filled the child's life with fear, shame and inferiority. The (girl felt herself unclean and unfit for friendships and love. The shame and self-reproach continued, for at no time was she given frank, sound, sex information.

Her other home guidance was also harmful. Her mother was most rigid and severe in her regulations concerning her friends and social life, and this close supervision intensified her feeling of weakness and impending dangers.

When she was given a frank explanation of the function of sex by the physician she consulted, her danger was past. Her doubts and fears disappeared as soon as the atmosphere of secrecy and accompanying feeling of shame were removed.

Our author states that this practice occurs frequently among children, and should call for attention but not anxiety. The hazard is not the effect on the mind or body, but the fears and anxieties aroused by the method of correction. Parents should not express horror or instill fears to meet this behavior difficulty. Sympathetic understanding, patient teaching, and frankness by the parents will lead the child more readily to overcome the practice, and will not undermine his confidence and self-esteem.

Henrietta at sixteen found life dull, and contemplated self-destruction. Her thinking then led her to consider finding pleasure and securing pretty clothes by pursuing a course already adopted by her sister. Her poverty, her lack of normal childhood amusement, made the course of abandoning her moral principles seem exciting and attractive.

It is not fair to pass judgment on Henrietta and girls in her position, for the attitude they develop. Youth is a time for amusements and gaieties, and if no wholesome recreation is afforded young persons, it is quite natural for them to seek it in thoughtless and unwise channels.

The developing sex impulse in adolescents needs to be better understood by parents. In homes where boys and girls meet frequently to play and dance and enjoy youth together, there is no great occasion for alarm. Where this harmless, natural association is denied, either by lack of a pleasant home or by too rigid puritanical standards, the frustrated impulse may lead to real difficulties.

Henrietta's difficulties were both the lack of frank instruction, and the lack of constructive direction. The importance of children gaining their information regarding matters of health, of the life processes, and the ideal of parenthood in a sane, natural way, cannot be over-emphasized. In homes where questions are evaded and the subject of sex physiology and development is left a mystery, the child's curiosity is not only stimulated but he develops a morbid attitude toward the whole subject. He then gains his information from sources such as his gang, and lurid magazines, and his entire conception of the part of sex in life becomes distorted. It becomes an unspeakable subject, one from which he gains an unwholesome pleasure in discussing and contemplating its unsavory aspects. The very mystery that his parents place upon the subject makes his attitude abnormal, morbid and unwholesome.

The child who receives frank answers to his early questions, and who has his own development explained to him in terms of ideals of parenthood is protected from this unpleasant and harmful speculation. Fore-armed with sound, accurate information from the parents whose sincerity he does not doubt, he will be able to dismiss the misinformation that he will later hear from his crowd or gang. He will also be spared the emotional upset when he finally realizes that his parents have deliberately given him false information.

Henrietta had further difficulty besides the lack of instruction. Her home had given her no opportunity for the outlet of her emotional interests. The release of this emotional energy is important to give the individual normal stable personality. The inherent craving of individuals for emotional satisfaction is termed the libido. If the libido finds expression for its great store of energy in harmless channels, the individual maintains a normal attitude towards life, and normal interests in the affairs of everyday living. If the libido finds no opportunity for release, that is, finds no emotional satisfaction in the daily associations, and in the regular scheme of living, the libido will find an outlet in some other channel, which may have undesirable effects on the person.

In terms of Henrietta her libido found no wholesome outlet. Her natural craving for emotional satisfaction was frustrated. Her parents did not realize how important these satisfactions are, until the effect of her barren emotional life was explained to them.

The libido can find expression and satisfaction in many channels. Affection and appreciation in the home are sources of emotional release. Games, parties, outdoor sports, recreation, new clothes, success in work, are all easily recognized as sources of emotional satisfaction, and releases of emotional energy.

Henrietta responded to the treatment prescribed, and her nearsighted plans of securing clothes and pleasures by sacrificing her standards was forgotten. She was not scolded, nor lectured, nor criticized. No attempt was made to change her attitude by discussing her responsibilities and duties. Her thwarted emotional life made an intellectual appeal futile.

The treatment outlined was agreeable work away from home, where she found pleasure in her work and in being with children. Her earnings made it possible for her to gain other small pleasures in the way of recreation. Her days that had been spent in pent up brooding were now changed to active happy ones.

It is apparent that wholesome activity, recreation and pleasant associations are normal releases of the emotional life. Associations should be varied. There is some danger of too strong attachment between parents and children or two children. A mother, especially a widowed one, might devote herself too entirely to her only son or daughter. Two friends of the opposite sex at. too early an age may make emotional ties that are upsetting when the necessity rises for separation. Two friends of the same sex may also become too dependent on each other for their later happiness.

There are types of individuals who do not mingle with groups readily or frequently. Such social expression as possible should be encouraged in these persons, but it must be remembered that the emotional energy can find expression in channels other than amusement. Creative work of any kind has been identified with emotional life. Any expression, whether through poetry, painting, music or other creative work, gives the person a real emotional satisfaction. This expression through creative effort, known as sublimation is the sex impulse released through other channels.

The program of sex education is based on frank information given by parents to children, and also on the direction of the emotional energy into channels of work, recreation, activity, and of its sublimation to satisfying, useful forms of expression.

Reference -- The Challenge Of Childhood by Ira S.Wile, pages 215-227

Questions and Problems

1. Why is frank sex information to children important?

2. Why should this information be given in the home ?

3. What is meant by the libido?

4. How can the libido find expression in normal channels?

5. What are normal emotional satisfactions for adolescents?

6. What are the dangers of lack of emotional expression?

7. What treatment was outlined for Henrietta?

8. What is meant by sublimation?

-------------------------------------------

1. The Relief Society magazine : Organ of the Relief Society of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. (n.d.). Retrieved from https://archive.org/stream/reliefsocietymag14reli#page/102

2. The Challenge Of Childhood. (n.d.). Retrieved from https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.274695/2015.274695.The-Challenge#page/n227

My Son Is Not Baptized And That Is Okay

My son isn't baptized. I'm okay with that and he hasn't missed out on any blessings.

My son's mother has refused to provide permission for his baptism, and I'm not only okay with that, I support her decision.

I wasn't okay with it at first. When his mother and I decided to separate, I knew it would become an issue, and I was troubled and confused with how to approach the topic with him and his mother. It would not be appropriate to represent her side without her personally contributing to this article. What I have felt is appropriate to share, I wrote in my blog post, "Because I Loved Her, I Left Her."

However, there is some risk to not including details. Generally, when I share my experience with why I am okay with my son not being baptized, someone almost always dismisses my experiences because their divorce and ex were hostile and not agreeable in the least. My not-sharing-the-details in all its messiness, pain, resentment, years of court and financial ruin is with purpose. The absence of my sharing isn't to be mistaken as an absence of those trials; rather, it’s an example of how I personally decided to model healthy behavior to my children.

Learning At Every Opportunity

Today, as my son and I drove home from church, he did what he does every Sunday afternoon drive home:  he was reviewing what he learned in Sunday School class. Today, after sharing the particular lesson, he also reflected on how it's sometimes difficult to hear the teachers get excited about his class graduating primary this year. They mentioned how the boys will be able to start passing the sacrament. He said, "I wanted to raise my hand and say, not everyone will get to pass the sacrament." But he didn't want to make anyone feel uncomfortable. We used the opportunity to revisit the meaning of baptism, priesthood and looking forward to when he turns 18 and can get baptized.

The conversations are always wonderful. Sometimes the conversations are started as a result of feeling left out and sad, like today. Sometimes that feeling continues throughout the conversation, and sometimes he has a rekindled hope that his mother might provide her permission. What makes it a little more difficult too is his older brother is baptized. He is the only one in primary and in his current family dynamic who is not baptized. Whenever and however these conversations come up, we explore and validate his emotions and feelings without removing them. We also never frame the conversation in any way that suggests his mother is wrong or bad for not providing the permission.

Praying Without Parenting

Over the years, we have prayed and fasted many times that his mother would be willing to change her decision. But this was not the prayer we should have been having. Although it’s appropriate on occasion to have faith that others will change their hearts, this was not the only prayer we should have been having. In a divorce especially, there is a huge problem with each separating spouse "parenting" the other. This is often done through divorce decrees, court, manipulation, threats, using children as "pawns," and "righteous indignation" (which is a form of spiritual abuse).

Not only as a divorced father, but as a therapist who routinely works with divorcing couples in the church, I've routinely seen good parents become so fixated on demanding their child's other parent accommodate religious activities that they become abusive. One particular parent had become convinced that her child would be denied all the blessings of the church if they couldn't get baptized. She spent years in therapy, court and tens of thousands of dollars attempting to get her child's father to grant permission for baptism. Her child during this period began to mirror their mother’s anxiety and fear of losing blessings. The child also started to view their father as an evil man who hated God.

Why is it spiritual abuse? When we place ourselves in a position of power to control, dictate or parent someone in a way that removes, blocks and prevents their choice, it's abusive. When religion is used as that vehicle of control, its religious/spiritual abuse. We don't get to parent, control or demand how our ex decides to parent. Their house, their rules. Our house, our rules.

Isn't it spiritual abuse to deny a child's baptism? No. It could be abuse if that parent is denying baptism out of a desire to hurt the child or the other parent. But this is problematic. Because we don't get to read people’s minds and hearts. But what if the ex SAYS they are doing it to get back at the other parent? Well, pay it no attention. Some people are more married divorced than when they were married.

Abuse is a serious accusation. I have no tolerance for abuse in any form, as a parent or therapist. If the child is in emotional, spiritual or physical danger, there is no gray area. What I have seen, however, is the word "abuse" used to describe a behavior one doesn't like or agree with in the other parent. Neglect is another word that is sometimes lightly used too. For example, the child's other parent is being "neglectful" by not agreeing to be consistent with church attendance or agreeing to let the child be baptized. Divorce is already difficult enough for us and our children. In most divorces, there are going to be clear differences in how each parent decides to parent or not parent. The best thing we can do is teach our children how to thrive in this environment.

Pray And Fast To Change Your Heart

Through our frequent prayers and fasting, it became clear my son was becoming overwhelmed— overwhelmed in not seeing his mom's "heart change," feeling like he was not having enough faith, feeling like he must continuously ask/pester her for permission and fear of getting her angry. Also, I was communicating a subtle and sometimes not so subtle message that his mom was wrong. Quietly, our prayers have never stopped for her to change her heart. But now we pray for a change of our own hearts. In this hyper-focus to change his mother’s heart, we were missing beautiful opportunities to learn and prepare for baptism—whenever that might happen.

When he would ask questions like, "Why won’t my mom let me get baptized?" instead of focusing on the differences in parenting, we would validate and explore how he could love and support his mother. We also explored how God will never deny him any blessings and that we should find ways to serve, and strengthen OUR OWN faith. This has radically and wonderfully changed the spirit of our conversations. Religion has not become a divide in my son and his mother’s life. Where pain could have thrived, beauty and love flourished. Neither I nor my son get to "tell" his mother how to parent. But we have taken the opportunity to learn our Father's will in our lives, in our current situation.

Changing Our Heart Will Increase Our Love For Others

Some parents decide to leave the church, and that's okay too. One of the most destructive things parents can do to their children is engage in "holy wars." Whether that's a parent who decides the LDS faith is bad and requests their name be removed from the records, or one whose religiosity changes over time, or a parent who insists on unwavering church attendance and service, there is a place for each of these parents in parenting well-adjusted and healthy children. But regardless of one's belief in God or the LDS church, what are we teaching our child if they can't love the parent who thinks differently? To a child, you have placed them in an impossible situation. You are communicating that if they stop believing as you do, they will experience the same rejection you are showing the other parent.

Sometimes the situation is reversed. Some parents who believe the church is hurting their child will go to the same lengths to prevent them from attending. But regardless of which parent it is, this divisiveness teaches children how to hate. Or at the very least, how to condition their love based on someone else’s belief system. Learning how to change our own heart restores confidence and expands our ability to love and value others.

No Blessing Is Ever Prevented Or Delayed

My son will not be passing the sacrament when he turns twelve. But that is not to be confused with a denying or preventing of his blessings. As sacred and symbolic as the sacrament is, the act of passing should never be confused as the blessing. My son knows and is intimately familiar with the covenants made in baptism and passing and taking the sacrament. He has been blessed with a spiritual growth, insight, maturity and faith that is far beyond what I had at his age. Sure, it’s difficult at times for him and I to know he's not going to be passing the sacrament or doing temple work with the other youth. But we use that as an opportunity to have our hearts changed and our faith strengthened.

I encourage those in similar situations to exemplify to their children who don't have permission to be baptized to find ways to love and grow, how to lovingly honor their other parent’s decision, how to expand one's faith beyond controlling others, and how to use faith to increase one's agency.

For those serving in callings over youth in similar circumstances, find ways to model the same love. Frame the conversation in ways the youth can participate versus focusing on what they can't do. There is never anything wrong with exploring or understanding a child's situation. But generally, do that with their parent. What I do recommend avoiding is asking "why" questions like, "Why do you think your mom won’t let you get baptized?" But rather, explore with the child what they are doing to grow in the gospel, and emphasize that our loving God will bless them fully in their desires.

I am so thankful for each of my son's teachers who have done exactly this. Their love and support has made this process easier to experience.

Daniel A. Burgess is the author of the forthcoming book on LDS Sexuality. He is also the creator and Admin of the Facebook Group "Improving Intimacy in Mormon Marriages" and content developer at its accompanying Blog, "Mormon Marriages."

“Don’t Touch” — Summary

Why This Article

As an active Latter-day Saint marriage and family therapist, I have worked with many clients who have struggled for many years with pornography and masturbation. At the same time, most of my couples work involves a need to cultivate increasing desire. The current approaches of reading more scriptures, prayer, temple attendance, more faith, and the 12-step addiction treatment model are just not working. In some cases, this approach of sin and fear-based motivation does more harm than good and makes the problems worse.

I have found a solution to struggles with masturbation and pornography that matches The Church of Jesus Christ doctrine on sexuality and gives dramatic results within months.

Historical Background

Church leaders in the 1800s and early 1900s, in contrast to prevailing notions of the day, taught that sexual urges and feelings are to be celebrated and encouraged as God-given. However, not one mention of masturbation as a sin can be found in scripture or in official teachings of this period. This was in stark contrast to culturally common medical quackery ideas from the 1700s, similar to bloodletting, that masturbation led to all manner of physical and mental disabilities. In the early 1900s, as medical research disproved these inaccurate fears, The Church published manuals that embraced the science that masturbation did not cause insanity.

Beginning in the 1950s, perhaps as a reaction to zoologist Alfred Kinsey’s 1948 and 1953 popular books on human sexuality that dismissed marriage and morality, Church leaders began an abrupt shift toward emphasizing sexuality as a serious sin. They also for the first time began asserting masturbation as a sin. This emphasis continued in various teachings through the 1980s. All of these assertions about masturbation, however, were given without support from scripture, and without support from medical research, which now mostly contradicted leaders’ assertions. Some people even specifically opposed medical science on the topic, in at least one case resulting in the suicide of a client and a wrongful malpractice settlement.

Current Teachings And Research

Anti-masturbation pamphlets and books are no longer available from official Church sources, though they are widely mocked among critics of The Church and are viewed with deep concern by medical professionals. The best known current official publication on the topic, For the Strength of Youth (2011), does not mention masturbation, but does suggest, “do not arouse these emotions in your own body” in the context of sexual contact with others. This statement is helpful in the context of caution around premarital sexual relations. However, it can also leave youth confused and guilty when they experience hormonal surges in which “these emotions” are aroused every day, without intention, through all kinds of normal healthy activities. Concerned young men are praying for God to take away the daily erections that are part of normal, healthy development. Local leaders vary widely in their approaches — some asserting masturbation is a serious sin, others convinced it is not a sin at all.

In the past few decades, the idea of “sexual addiction” has been introduced, and Latter-day Saint efforts often utilize ideas based on the Alcoholics Anonymous 12-step program. Elder Oaks’ 2015 Ensign article did not discuss masturbation but suggested caution about the over-use of addiction treatment for pornography, asserting, “In fact, most young men and young women who struggle with pornography are not addicted.” His article cited extensively from medical research. Many medical professionals argue that research does not support categorizing sexuality as an addiction and that treating it as such does not work because it reduces personal responsibility and uses fear as a motivator. In addition, this anti-biology mentality can lead to many married couples who struggle with overcoming past fears and shame to cultivate healthy sexual desire.

A Solution That Works

Below is a solution that I found works and is compatible with scripture with the restored gospel that sexuality is a God-given, healthy and positive part of our mortal experience. It avoids fear or addiction as a motivator and is compatible with scientific research.

The goal: sexual self-mastery, not sexual self-rejection

Understand the truth that God created your sexual feelings because He loves you and wants you to have joy and to multiply and replenish the earth. Recognize that masturbation is not supported as a sin in any scripture, and was not mentioned at all by Church leaders until the 1950s. Therefore, it cannot be as serious as sins such as failing to love yourself or others and a number of other issues repeatedly emphasized in all the standard works. Medical science does not support physical or mental harms from masturbation, but does show significant harms from excessive guilt, shame, fear, and aversion to sexual feelings. Involve the Lord in the process of cultivating, appreciating, and mastering, and not removing, suppressing, or rejecting sexual desire.

Track baseline activities for 2-4 weeks. Measure your normal daily activities without attempts at abstinence — record when you use porn or masturbate as well as prayer, scriptures, temple attendance, and physical activity, and note emotional or other life challenges.

Measure progress toward your own individual goals on these items and report to the Lord in prayer. Use these data charts to identify patterns related to scripture, prayer, temple, fitness or time connecting with others. Continue to masturbate as a beautiful, respectful discovery of one's individual sexual desires, including planning time to explore and enjoy your body. The goal is sexual self-mastery, not rejection and elimination.

Study and learn from the best books. Using accurate and well-researched information, become familiar with your own arousal cycle and desires, and male and female biology and hormones.

For parents:

Teach by example the beauty of sexual desire. When addressing your child’s sexual desires and masturbation, focus on the beauty of desire and emphasize how amazing those feelings are. Offer them insights into how we are to learn and master our bodies. Celebrate with them that they are experiencing this new phase of life and how much more amazing it will be if mastered and learned. A youth learning and developing into their pubescent years is no more experiencing a sin by masturbating than a diabetic learning how to control and regulate their blood sugar.

For leaders:

Teach self-mastery concepts to parents. Stop telling youth that masturbation is a sin or dwelling on spiritual or physical fears. Avoid abstract timelines like abstinence for 14 days. Also, your role is spiritual counselor, not a mental health professional. You are not qualified to call a struggle with self-mastery an addiction. Don’t immediately send youth to the church’s Addiction Recovery Program or an effort modeled like Sons of Helaman or Daughters of Light. If the problem is severe enough that they cannot function in everyday life, recommend a professional therapist and let that professional determine the mental health issues that may or may not be involved.

Additional Resources

Facebook Group "Improving Intimacy in Mormon Marriages”

Blog, "Mormon Marriages"

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Read the full blog here:

Table of Contents

0. Introduction

1. Background — It Happened Again

2. Context Is Important: A Brief History Of Masturbation Beliefs Within The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

3. Cultivating Versus Condemning

4. What Went Wrong?

5. A New Culture Is Born: “Doctrine And Addiction” And Returning To The 1700s

6. Purity, Modesty, And Moral Ambiguity

7. Solution: Real Self-Mastery Cultivating Sexuality

Oral Sex

Exploring the Appropriateness of Oral Sex in Marital Intimacy: A Comprehensive Analysis of LDS Church Teachings

Exploring the LDS Church's stance on intimate behaviors within marriage and the cultural and moral inconsistencies that arise

[Editors Note, March 2021: This blog post refers to content that could be found in the LDS Handbook 2. Since this blog was published, that Handbook has now been marked as “obsolete,” and the Church’s website will redirect you to its current handbook. Please keep in mind that some of the quotes/phrases debated in this blog post no longer exist in updated church literature.]

Introduction

The appropriateness of oral sex within a marital relationship has been a topic of great debate for years. This discussion has led to confusion and misinterpretation of various teachings, creating moral and spiritual inconsistency within our culture. This article aims to provide a comprehensive analysis of the LDS Church's stance on intimate behaviors within marriage and the resulting inconsistencies that arise from the debate. By dissecting the official LDS Handbook 2, exploring cultural confusion, and examining the implications of past teachings, we aim to shed light on the question: Is oral sex an appropriate sexual behavior, or is it an "unnatural" and "unholy" sexual practice?

LDS Handbook 2 on Sexual Behavior in Marriage

The official LDS Handbook 2: Administering the Church provides limited guidance on sexual behavior in marriage, stating the following:

"Married couples should also understand that sexual relations within marriage are divinely approved not only for the purpose of procreation but also as a way of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual bonds between husband and wife." (21.4.4 Birth Control) [1]

"The Lord’s law of chastity is abstinence from sexual relations outside of lawful marriage and fidelity within marriage. Sexual relations are proper only between a man and a woman who are legally and lawfully wedded as husband and wife. Adultery, fornication, homosexual or lesbian relations, and every other unholy, unnatural, or impure practice are sinful. Members who violate the Lord’s law of chastity or who influence others to do so are subject to Church discipline." (21.4.5 Chastity and Fidelity) [2]

These two quotes provide general guidance but do not offer explicit instruction on specific behaviors within marriage. The debate on the appropriateness of oral sex within marriage arises from the phrase "...and every other unholy, unnatural, or impure practice are sinful."

Cultural Confusion and Subjectivity

The phrase mentioned above has led to differing interpretations and confusion among church members. In their book "Real Intimacy: A Couples' Guide to Healthy, Genuine Sexuality," authors Thomas G. Harrison, Kristin B. Hodson, and Alisha Worthington address this cultural confusion:

"There is a quote from a handbook produced by the LDS Church that advises people to guard against anything "unnatural" within the bonds of their sexual relationship. This is where semantics come into play. What exactly does "unnatural" mean? Is it "unnatural to stick your tongue in your spouse's ear because the ear isn't a "natural" place for a tongue to go? Some people interpret "unnatural" to mean anything other than the traditional missionary sexual position, while others have a much broader definition of the word. Who is right?" (Real Intimacy, pg. 98) [3]

The subjectivity of the term "unnatural" has led to a variety of opinions, some even claiming that sex for any purpose other than procreation is unnatural and an abuse of sacred power. Others argue that oral sex, specifically, is an "unholy, unnatural, or impure practice," often citing President Kimball's January 5, 1982, letter to leadership: "...The First Presidency has interpreted oral sex as constituting an 'unnatural, impure, or unholy practice.'" [4]

Contextual Issues with Quoting President Kimball's Letter

There are at least three significant issues with quoting President Kimball's letter out of context.

First, the quote often omits the following sentence: "If a person is engaged in a practice which troubles him enough to ask about it, he should discontinue it." [5] This sentence highlights the importance of individual conscience, but it also raises additional questions regarding the influence of family, culture, taboo, and traditions on feelings of being "troubled" by specific behaviors.

Second, the January 5, 1982 letter was specifically addressed to the interviewing leadership of the Church. The First Presidency emphasized the importance of saving souls and provided guidance on conducting worthiness interviews. In the context of discussing "no unclean thing" entering the temple, they list several potential "unclean" practices, including oral sex. However, it can be interpreted that the context implies oral sex as an abuse of power within a marriage. Thus, oral sex, when engaged in mutually and without coercion, is between the couple and the Lord and is not inherently abusive or unnatural. [6]

Third, nine months after the January 5, 1982 letter, the First Presidency issued another letter on October 15, 1982, responding to numerous complaints about the intrusiveness of worthiness interviews. They reminded leaders to follow the "temple recommend book" precisely and not to inquire into personal, intimate matters involving marital relations. Leaders were also instructed not to pursue questions about the propriety of specific conduct if asked by a member. [7]

Despite these clarifications, some members continue to cite the January 5, 1982 letter as evidence that oral sex is an "unnatural, impure, or unholy practice." They often argue that a Prophet's words are as good as a command, citing Doctrine & Covenants 21:4 ("Thou shalt give heed unto all his words and commandments which he shall give unto you"). [8] This selective interpretation creates a paradox in which church members demand clarity in all things while also proclaiming that "it is not meet that [God] should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant" (D&C 58:26). [9]

Moral and Spiritual Inconsistency

The insistence that oral sex (or other sexual behaviors) is an "unnatural, impure, or unholy practice" reveals a moral and spiritual inconsistency in our culture. Those who argue against oral sex often simultaneously argue that birth control is between the couple and the Lord. However, there have been more statements specifically declaring the "evil" and "selfishness" of birth control than those about marital sexual behaviors. [10]

In the past, the LDS Church's position on birth control was more strict, with statements from leaders condemning its use. However, over time, this stance has softened, and the current church teachings allow couples to decide for themselves the appropriateness of using birth control. [11]

Conclusion

The debate surrounding the appropriateness of oral sex within marriage highlights the importance of understanding the context and intent of church teachings. When examining the official LDS Handbook 2, we can see that there is limited guidance on specific sexual behaviors within marriage. The subjectivity of the term "unnatural" has contributed to confusion and varying interpretations among church members.

It is crucial to remember that past teachings must be understood in their proper context, as seen with President Kimball 's January 5, 1982 letter. Failing to consider the context and intent of the letter can lead to misunderstandings and misinterpretations. The First Presidency's October 15, 1982 letter further emphasizes the importance of respecting the privacy of marital relations and not delving into personal, intimate matters.

The paradox of seeking clarity in all things while asserting that God should not command in all things can create confusion and inconsistency within the church. As church members, it is essential to acknowledge that individual conscience and the relationship between the couple and the Lord should guide marital sexual behavior.

Furthermore, the inconsistency in the cultural perspective on oral sex and birth control illustrates the need for a more comprehensive understanding of the evolution of church teachings. Recognizing the changes in the church's stance on birth control can help provide a more balanced approach to understanding the guidelines around sexual behavior in marriage.

In conclusion, the question of whether oral sex is appropriate sexual behavior within marriage should be approached with understanding, respect, and consideration of the context of church teachings. It is essential to remember that marital sexual behavior is a deeply personal and private matter, and it should be guided by individual conscience and the relationship between the couple and the Lord. Ultimately, open communication, mutual respect, and a shared commitment to nurturing emotional and spiritual bonds can help couples navigate the complexities of sexual intimacy within marriage.

References:

[1] LDS Handbook 2: Administering the Church, 21.4.4 Birth Control

Previous handbook: "Married couples should also understand that sexual relations within marriage are divinely approved not only for the purpose of procreation, but also as a way of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual bonds between husband and wife."  21.4.4 Birth Control

New Handbook: Physical intimacy between husband and wife is intended to be beautiful and sacred. It is ordained of God for the creation of children and for the expression of love between husband and wife (see 2.1.2). 38.6.4 Birth Control

[2] LDS Handbook 2: Administering the Church, 21.4.5 Chastity and Fidelity

Previous handbook: "The Lord’s law of chastity is abstinence from sexual relations outside of lawful marriage and fidelity within marriage. Sexual relations are proper only between a man and a woman who are legally and lawfully wedded as husband and wife. Adultery, fornication, homosexual or lesbian relations, and every other unholy, unnatural, or impure practice are sinful. Members who violate the Lord’s law of chastity or who influence others to do so are subject to Church discipline."  21.4.5 Chastity and Fidelity

New Handbook: [Removes the language of ‘unholy, unnatural…’] “Physical intimacy between husband and wife is intended to be beautiful and sacred. It is ordained of God for the creation of children and for the expression of love between husband and wife.” 38.6.5 Chastity and Fidelity

[3] "Real Intimacy: A Couples' Guide to Healthy, Genuine Sexuality" by Thomas G. Harrison,‎ Kristin B. Hodson,‎ Alisha Worthington pg 98

[4] "The First Presidency has interpreted oral sex as constituting an 'unnatural, impure, or unholy practice.'"

[5] "If a person is engaged in a practice which troubles him enough to ask about it, he should discontinue it."

[6] January 5, 1982 letter, context, and interpretation

[7] October 15, 1982 letter, responding to complaints about the intrusiveness of worthiness interviews

[8] Doctrine & Covenants 21:4 ("Thou shalt give heed unto all his words and commandments which he shall give unto you")

[9] Doctrine & Covenants 58:26 ("it is not meet that [God] should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant")

[10] More statements specifically declaring the "evil" and "selfishness" of birth control than those about marital sexual behaviors

• Kimball, S. W. (1969). "The Role of Marriage in America," Ensign, September 1976.

• McConkie, B. R. (1966). "Birth Control: Is It Up to Man?" Ensign, August 1971.

• Benson, E. T. (1972). "To the Mothers in Zion," Ensign, May 1987.

• Smith, J. F. (1907). "Marriage and Birth Control," Juvenile Instructor, vol. 42, pp. 40-41.

• Clark, J. R. (1969). "God's Free Children," Ensign, November 1987.

These sources contain quotes from various LDS leaders in which they explicitly express their opposition to birth control and describe it as "evil" or "selfish." However, it is worth noting that these quotes are not the only statements made by LDS leaders on the topic of birth control, and that there is a range of opinions within the church on this issue.

[11] Evolution of the LDS Church's position on birth control

• Hardy, B. (2018). “Birth Control,” in The Mormon Church and Birth Control: A History. University of Illinois Press.

• Flake, K. (2004). The Politics of American Religious Identity: The Seating of Senator Reed Smoot, Mormon Apostle. UNC Press Books.

• Quinn, D. M. (1997). The Mormon Hierarchy: Extensions of Power. Signature Books.

• Staker, M. A. (2017). “The Birth Control Controversy,” in Hearken, O Ye People: The Historical Setting of Joseph Smith’s Ohio Revelations. Greg Kofford Books.

• Walch, T. (2019). Church Historian’s Press Announces Publication of “The Diaries of Emmeline B. Wells”. Church News.

Applying Lessons Learned

In light of the debate surrounding oral sex and the inconsistencies it reveals in our culture, it is important to apply the lessons learned in our understanding and approach to other aspects of our lives. The following are some key takeaways from this discussion:

1. Context Matters: When interpreting church teachings or any information, it is crucial to consider the context in which the statements were made. This helps to prevent misunderstandings and the perpetuation of misinformation.

2. Respect for Privacy: Personal and intimate matters, such as marital sexual behavior, should be treated with respect and privacy. Intrusive questions and discussions can cause unnecessary discomfort and may lead to the spread of false or outdated information.

3. Emphasize Individual Conscience and Spiritual Guidance: Recognize that individuals and couples have unique experiences and perspectives. Encourage reliance on personal conscience and spiritual guidance from the Lord to navigate the complexities of life, including decisions about sexual intimacy in marriage.

4. Foster Open Communication: Encourage open communication between couples, helping them to discuss their feelings, desires, and concerns about sexual intimacy. This can help to create a healthy foundation for their relationship and ensure mutual understanding and respect.

5. Be Mindful of Cultural Inconsistencies: Acknowledge the potential for cultural inconsistencies in our approach to various topics, such as oral sex and birth control. Seek to understand the evolution of church teachings and strive for a more balanced and informed perspective.

6. Adaptability and Growth: Recognize that church teachings and societal attitudes can change over time. Be open to adapting your understanding and approach to various issues as new information becomes available.

In conclusion, the debate surrounding the appropriateness of oral sex within marriage offers valuable insights into the importance of context, privacy, individual conscience, and open communication. By applying these lessons, church members can cultivate a more balanced, informed, and respectful approach to a wide range of topics and issues. In doing so, they can create an environment that fosters growth, understanding, and spiritual unity.

Additional Resources

LDS therapists often approach the topic of oral sex in the context of a healthy, consensual, and respectful marital relationship. They emphasize the importance of open communication, consent, and individual agency in making decisions about sexual intimacy within marriage. Here are a few quotes and citations from sex-positive LDS therapists:

• Dr. Jennifer Finlayson-Fife, a licensed psychotherapist and relationship coach who specializes in working with LDS couples, has spoken about the importance of a healthy sexual relationship within marriage. In an interview with Rational Faiths, she said:

"I think people have to be thoughtful and prayerful about their sexual relationship and what feels good to them and what feels right to them. I think it's okay to be uncomfortable and to push your comfort zone some, but I also think it's okay to have your own sense of what feels right to you and to honor that." Link: https://www.finlayson-fife.com/podcasts/conversations-with-dr-jennifer/podcast/rational-faiths

• Natasha Helfer, a licensed marriage and family therapist and certified sex therapist, has addressed the topic of oral sex in the context of LDS marriages. In an article for the Mormon Mental Health Association, she wrote:

"Many couples report that oral sex is an important part of their sexual repertoire and helps increase not only pleasure, but emotional connection and intimacy. As long as both parties feel comfortable and consensual with any sexual activity, there should be no shame or guilt associated with it." Link: https://www.mormonmentalhealthassoc.org/_blog/mmha_blog/post/oral_sex/

• Dr. Kristin Hodson, a licensed clinical social worker and certified sex therapist, co-authored "Real Intimacy: A Couples' Guide to Healthy, Genuine Sexuality," a book for LDS couples seeking to build healthy and satisfying sexual relationships. In the book, Hodson and her co-authors discuss the subjectivity of the term "unnatural" in the context of sexual behaviors:

"What exactly does 'unnatural' mean? Is it 'unnatural' to stick your tongue in your spouse's ear because the ear isn't a 'natural' place for a tongue to go? Some people interpret 'unnatural' to mean anything other than the traditional missionary sexual position, while others have a much broader definition of the word. Who is right?" Link: https://www.amazon.com/Real-Intimacy-Couples-Healthy-Genuine-ebook/dp/B007C8NRC6

• Laura M. Brotherson, a licensed marriage and family therapist, certified sex therapist, and author of "And They Were Not Ashamed: Strengthening Marriage through Sexual Fulfillment," has discussed a variety of topics related to sexuality and marriage from an LDS perspective. In her book, she encourages couples to openly communicate about their desires, boundaries, and comfort levels to foster a healthy, satisfying, and intimate connection:

"Mutual understanding and agreement about sexual practices within marriage is essential for a couple's physical and emotional intimacy. This includes discussing and agreeing upon personal preferences and boundaries regarding any aspect of sexual expression, including oral sex." Link: https://www.amazon.com/They-Were-Not-Ashamed-Strengthening/dp/1587830347

• Julie de Azevedo Hanks, a licensed clinical social worker, psychotherapist, and owner of Wasatch Family Therapy, has shared her insights on sexual intimacy within marriage from an LDS perspective. In an interview with KSL, she emphasized the importance of communication, consent, and individual agency:

"Every couple needs to decide what they feel comfortable with in their intimate relationship. Couples need to communicate openly about their desires, boundaries, and comfort levels to foster a healthy, satisfying, and intimate connection. This may include discussing preferences and comfort levels regarding oral sex." Link: https://www.ksl.com/article/46430115/ask-an-expert-how-to-talk-to-your-spouse-about-sex

While these LDS therapists may not specifically mention oral sex in their public interviews or writings, their approach to sexual relationships within marriage encourages couples to communicate openly about their desires, boundaries, and comfort levels to foster a healthy, satisfying, and intimate connection, which can include discussing preferences and comfort levels regarding oral sex.

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